City of Hudson, New York · Common Council · Transcript

Common Council, Regular Meeting

Tuesday, November 18, 2025 · 1:08:02

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  1. 1:46session. Please rise force to the flag of United States of America to the standice for that here. here.
  2. 2:22Morris
  3. 2:22here.
  4. 2:24Hagen.
  5. 2:26Roberts
  6. 2:27here.
  7. 2:28Rooney
  8. 2:29here.
  9. 2:33Here
  10. 2:36presenting the minutes of the October 1921 readings and place them on file. and second and all those in favor please signify by saying I
  11. 2:53anyone opposed [clears throat] committee reports have been posted to the city website and I have an introduction and a second to place them on one and all those in favor please signify by saying I
  12. 3:11anyone opposed it's carried also So we have quite a few communications. I hope you made yourself familiar with the housing authority documents and may I have an introduction a second to place all the communications on file. Trisha and Lola. All those favor by saying I Okay, the motion carries. [clears throat] Okay, we go over the um resolutions from last week that were introduced. purposes commissioner of deeds. Someone has something to say. Hello vote, please.
  13. 4:06Council member Bell.
  14. 4:12Hi.
  15. 4:14Hi Mo. Yay.
  16. 4:29Robert, I mean, yes.
  17. 4:42Uh, the next resolution approves the sale of Long Avenue. There any questions? comments. Roll call, please.
  18. 4:57Council member,
  19. 4:58hi.
  20. 5:00Hi.
  21. 5:01Moranti.
  22. 5:02Hi.
  23. 5:03Mam Morris.
  24. 5:06Hi.
  25. 5:08Hi.
  26. 5:10Hi.
  27. 5:12Hi.
  28. 5:14Hi.
  29. 5:16Hi.
  30. 5:18Hi. there.
  31. 5:21The next resolution is uh an amendment for churn entre questions.
  32. 5:28I have a question.
  33. 5:29Okay.
  34. 5:30So, this is an extra 20,000 planning board wants for their u legal fees. Correct.
  35. 5:38Uh yes.
  36. 5:40So, what is the total bill that their attorney fees is for the year? Anyone wants? Is it A lot of question a lot of it is um passed off to the applicant.
  37. 5:55Tom,
  38. 5:56yes.
  39. 5:58Tom, it's Heather. Can I interrupt? I'm sorry. [clears throat]
  40. 6:02Um that that is not actually what it is. That there was um a Can you hear me?
  41. 6:13Can you guys hear me? Can you guys hear me?
  42. 6:19I think we have because he was playing. So, it's not that important.
  43. 6:26Oh,
  44. 6:29Heather, I can hear you.
  45. 6:32When they hear you, you can you can translate for me.
  46. 6:41Why not hear something? Justin, can you hear me?
  47. 6:49Heather, I hear you crystal clear. Can anybody hear me?
  48. 6:53Yeah, I think all can be heard. I don't know that they can hear us.
  49. 6:58We can hear us.
  50. 7:00Okay. Can you hear me or only Justin and Crystal?
  51. 7:04No, we can hear you.
  52. 7:06Okay. Okay, good.
  53. 7:07So, um, in in fact, that is not a resolution for planning board attorney fees. that is in fact transferring money out of the planning board budget into the attorney fees line. And that is because um there was a significant amount of excess funds in the planning board budget because uh when the budget was very first established uh there was an assumption made that the planning board was going to be reviewing the sewer extensions. That did not happen. DPW does that. So the planning board is not in need of those funds. Uh but at the same time the actual legal expenses for the city as a whole are um
  54. 7:44underfunded at this point. So it's a transfer out of planning board into legal
  55. 7:56council member.
  56. 7:57Hi.
  57. 8:00Hi
  58. 8:01Morancey.
  59. 8:02Hi
  60. 8:03M.
  61. 8:04Hi
  62. 8:05Morris.
  63. 8:06Hi
  64. 8:07Hagen. Hi
  65. 8:09Roberts. [clears throat]
  66. 8:10Hi
  67. 8:11Brownie.
  68. 8:12Hi
  69. 8:17President.
  70. 8:18I car.
  71. 8:20The next resolution involves the green board charge act. Did you want to? Yeah. Oh god. I really I would have loved to have had a better explanation as to why we are charged so much more than we see.
  72. 8:41We all come through.
  73. 8:45I even tried to communicate and nothing happened.
  74. 8:49Yeah. The Hail Mary.
  75. 8:53Yeah. So this is the level at which we were funding them before. Correct. Correct. So when they came before us asking for 200,000 and they right they never followed up with anything. So there's been no further communication on that.
  76. 9:10Anything else?
  77. 9:11No vote please.
  78. 9:14Council member
  79. 9:15no hi. Hi mhagen. Hi
  80. 9:28Roberts.
  81. 9:29Hi
  82. 9:30Rooney.
  83. 9:31Hi
  84. 9:32Sar.
  85. 9:33Hi
  86. 9:34Bolo.
  87. 9:35Hi
  88. 9:36President Dra.
  89. 9:37I last week's resolution is this is um approving the cooperation agreement amendment with Hudson Housing Authority.
  90. 9:50Questions?
  91. 9:51Yeah. Can we get an explanation of this? I tried to go back to the 2019 agreement and then to this agreement. Um, what happens after this one is setting it up? Well, first of all, can we get an explanation? I did talk to Crystal earlier today for everybody to understand why this agreement is in place because this is a um cooperation agreement, but it references pilots and this is a property that is off tax ro. So I think everybody needs to understand why this is necessary. Uh also this has
  92. 10:24been switched to instead of being a 30,000 per year it has been switched to a lump sum payment. So what happens after four years? Um it's been 30,000 since 2019. There's no escalator or anything on this. So can we get
  93. 10:42certain questions [clears throat] for the housing authority all your questions so introduce teams tonight from John owner who's the housing authorities of this project who is the executive director of that and I got project manager working on this. So a great question that you asked about why are we here? So under New York state law property owned by housing authorities except real property taxation that's both from the RPL and also in public housing law. uh years ago when HUD was giving funds to municipality these federal housing projects like West
  94. 11:42Tower the policy of HUD was that even though these properties would be exempt from taxes that the housing authorities should enter into cooperation agreements or other word they called them cooperation agreements back then which is if you actually look that's what the first cooperation agreement for this was was called which basically provided that the housing authorities would pay um a certain sum. Usually it was 5% of grow of of net rents um to the municipality to reimburse the municipality for services that the municipality is providing to the housing property. Streets need to be paid, potholes need to be filled, roads need to be plowed, trash needs to be picked up, that type of thing. So that was the
  95. 12:27policy of HUD for for decades. And so HUD would pay housing authorities a bunch of money through the year to be able to upkeep and maintain and run that the housing authority properties. And then Congress for decades began to dis disinvest in housing authorities, disinvest in HUD, which is what led us to the problem that, you know, the Obama administration uh took on back in 2008. And they they developed what was called the rental assistance demonstration program, RAD program, which would enable housing authorities to convert from section 9 public housing projects to section 8 public housing projects. So
  96. 13:07again again a housing project overseen by HUD with funding from HUD but moves from sanctions to sanction. Um so back in 2019 um I was council from the housing authority then as well. The housing authority board approached uh the common council saying we want to do a rad conversion. They had received what was called housing assistant payment contract from HUD. Uh it was important then to do it at that time because the the the it's called a half the half payment uh was quite advantageous to the
  97. 13:44housing authority at that time based on just where the federal government's budget were was happening was at the housing authority and so while the housing authority recognized that there were some challenges with bliss tower at that point in time they determined to do what's called straight route conversion which is a convert from section 9 to section 8 that locked in the halfp payment. So, regardless of what Congress does with budgets, we have a uh I think it's a 30-year 30-year agreement with HUD for these half payments.
  98. 14:14How much are they?
  99. 14:15And what's that?
  100. 14:16How much are they?
  101. 14:17I don't know off the top of my head. Do you guys you know how much your half payments are?
  102. 14:22How much are payments? Yeah,
  103. 14:25they vary because they they do it based on, you know, what we're renting into lease, but we put about 500,000 a year out into the into the economy here.
  104. 14:38Yeah. So, so and so that those those come so that's you know other than the rent that that the housing authority is getting from tenants, they're getting the half that's really the source of those those are the two.
  105. 14:50Is that the balance of the voucher? So you're getting rent from a tenant and then you're getting payment.
  106. 14:57Yeah. I mean that yes and no. I mean it's a section 8 a private section 8 voucher is a little bit different here. So these are project based vouchers, right? And so they're attached to the project like a a tenant can't just get the voucher from the housing authority that walk down the street and give it to you have a oh
  107. 15:16right. Exactly. So it's it's locked to the project,
  108. 15:18but it's it's the uh housing parody equivalent.
  109. 15:22What's that?
  110. 15:22It's the equivalent of about
  111. 15:24equivalent. Yes. Yeah. But so but it's not it doesn't the half payment doesn't necessarily work the same like necessarily work the same way as a private as a as a tenant based voucher would necessit. But essentially, yes, the half payment makes the difference between what the unit rents for and then the entire cost of of operating and maintaining the the the housing authority project. So in 2019, it was advantageous for the housing authority to do at that time. they did at that time. Part of what HUD required us to do
  112. 15:58as part of that RAD conversion was to redo the cooperation agreement with the city council, which the city council did. [clears throat] Several of you were here when that happened. Um, and so that was part of a a pretty robust review by the city and and that's where we came there.
  113. 16:21That that was our 2000 new year. No, that was for I mean it works out to 30,000 a year but it was it was based on yeah it was essentially yes 30,000 right so it was how it comes out so what's happening now is if you look at the bliss site or if you look at the housing authority site so you've got second street that runs north and south you got state street bisects the two properties you got bliss apartments on one side the vacant lot on the other Okay. And so the vacant lot is going to
  114. 16:56be what we're calling phase one. Bliss and Columbia apartments is what we're going to call phase two. So the vacant lot, what's what the state is requiring us to do. And it's the state, it's also our our tax credit investor. It's also our lenders for this. um they they generally require or would strongly prefer I I would say really [clears throat] require some sort of agreement like a cooperation agreement with the local municipality that creates a level or expected taxation for the property. So the state's going to dump millions of dollars into this project and the way that they do that is by issuing 4% tax exempt bonds. Those 4% tax exempt bonds
  115. 17:41are offered out to pension funds and all sorts of other places that buy them and then that money is then taken and used to build the building here. Additionally, you're going to have your tax credit investor who's coming in who's going to be, you know, paying a certain amount uh on tax credit and putting in millions of dollars into this and will be an, you know, will actually be an equity member of the development entity. um you know construction lender who's going to be providing a letter of credit to provide the construction financing. So you've got all these people who are willing to to take on the
  116. 18:16risk to help build this project but they want to mitigate the risks and one of the risks that they want to mitigate is [clears throat] now we could say look this project is exempt from real property taxes because it's owned by the housing authority. No criticism against your assessor, but some assessor down the road could look at this and say, "Oh, you know what? I don't think that this is actually exempt and could just willy-nilly stick back on the tax rules." And if that happens, then
  117. 18:42there's going to suddenly be a different tax bill for it. And while there is ways to challenge that, it takes time to challenge that. And in the meantime, it creates an un an unknown surge in expenses, which then puts at risk the long-term viability of the project. And so what the state wants to know is the state wants because the state is going to allocate millions of dollars towards this project. And what they want to know is that they're allocating not a dollar more than that's
  118. 19:11needed, but also not a dollar less than that's needed because there's a lot of communities that also need affordable hous. And so they'll say, "Okay, we're gonna underwrite this." And so Joel and Carlos and their team, they have together the development budget, but also the operating budget that looks out at this thing for 35 42 years. And they want to be able investors in the state want to be able to look at it and say this thing is going to go for 354 without without any you know, we've
  119. 19:39controlled the expenses. We think we can control. Of course, there's some expenses that we can't, but we're going to control as much as we can. And so this is a big expense that can be controlled. And so the way they want to do that is through doing these cooperation. Some some sometimes we call them cooperation agreement. Sometimes we call them a pilot agreement. Sometimes we call them a host community benefit agreement. But at the end of the day what it is, it's an agreement that provides that this property is going to be exempted from taxes. In return for that, the project
  120. 20:09is going to pay set amount of revenues to the municipality. Now here your question about $30,000. This is what's being proposed. We would, what we're asking is, we're asking that from now through the end of construction, which would be 2028, that payments under what I'm going to call the bliss or phase 2 agreement, okay, would be held in a banks and payments under this new agreement instead there would be a lump sum payment of $120,000 to the city when we close on our construction financing, which we anticipate to be sometime middle like
  121. 20:56July fallish of 2026. So the $120,000 payment.
  122. 21:01Can I ask you a question right there because I have you go along.
  123. 21:05So phase one, one of the other things here is that you're separating the property into components. And so phase one is the vacant lot where you are now going to be building the replacement housing for the current residence of GL.
  124. 21:19Um once that's done there will be um demolition of Bliss and then
  125. 21:25that's part of phase two.
  126. 21:26That's part of phase two and then building of additional units. Okay. So is the separation taking the lot that where you're going to build the replacement housing for the current place residence?
  127. 21:37Yes. Um,
  128. 21:39that's the new pilot,
  129. 21:40right? And that's what the 120,000 is for.
  130. 21:43The 120,000 is is an interim payment to cover because there's this is winding down,
  131. 21:50right?
  132. 21:50Right. And so the housing authority at the end of the day, the housing authority at the end of the day, you know, only has the half payments it gets and rent from tenants. They still got all the costs of Like you can't like just shut one part down, right? You can't just shut one part down at Bliss.
  133. 22:12Like so they've still got people throughout. So the the the expenses at Bliss aren't changing from whether it's full or empty really.
  134. 22:21And so as it's being wound down, they still have a full plate of expenses, but half a plate of income. And so the challenges that the that the housing authority is having is how are we going to make this how are we going to make these payments during this time that list is being wound down and that we're building new housing. And so what we're asking is and and and we're we're putting this in our development budget is that this $120,000 municipal impact fee is going to come in
  135. 22:48through our various funders and then be paid directly to the city. $120,000 which will cover
  136. 22:56three or four year period.
  137. 22:57Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. essentially and and then under and then once um construction is done which we're expecting 2028 we would have so so the housing authorities been paying their pilot payment in a rears so whole year goes by and then and so we want to continue that so the first pilot payment which would be for the 2029 year would be due January 123rd and so at that point then what we've offered is we've said $200 a increasing every year by a certain percent. I think it's 2%. Uh
  138. 23:32there is an estimated
  139. 23:34Yeah, there's that 250 is higher than the current.
  140. 23:37Yes. Yeah. Yeah. We took Yeah. current is somewhere around 215 220
  141. 23:42230
  142. 23:42230. So, so we increased it what we've currently been paying and then instead of having it be fixed to like how much rents collected or whatnot, we just said we're just going to increase it and then we're just going to escalate it with an escalator for 30 years or so,
  143. 23:59right? So, so that will happen. So essentially, and then at the same point, what that allows us to do, and the reason why we want to separate this is because when it comes to phase two, we want to be able to then come back to you and say, "Hey, we're going to do phase two now. This is what the project is, and we're going to do a new cooperation agreement that we're going to terminate the old one. I don't know if we're going to have the same investor. I don't know if we're going to have the same lenders." And so I do know that we're going to have the same state, obviously.
  144. 24:27But, you know, but what what I want to be able to do is not have to deal with the current the investors and the lenders on page one. I just want to be able to say, "Okay, we've got new investors over here." And so now we're going to terminate the the 2019 pilot and we're just going to create this new pilot now for phase two. And I would anticipate it would probably be a similar structure as this one. payments per unit increasing over the term of that over the term um you know
  145. 24:59something something along those lines. So um the reason I'm asking all these questions is that you know what's in front of us none of that detail was apparent and I was trying to figure out what exactly
  146. 25:13um and when you Dominic and I start on the IDA and usually when we're looking at something like this we see all of we see the 30 year in this case 35 year span we see the escalators we all of those things are all lined out and none of this either came before legal or before the finance department or committee. And so my concern is you're we're signing something. Yes, you're telling us all this detail now, but we have nothing in writing.
  147. 25:42Well, the you have I I'll push back a little bit. I hear what you said, but you you you have the pilot agreement. And if you look at the exhibit to the new pilot, the new cooperation agreement, there is a schedule of of of what's being paid. Your your your council member is looking at right now that so it is there. So you can you can see what we intend to pack. You know, I did include an explanatory email that kind of sets out what we're trying to do. You know, here as well in terms of
  148. 26:09the budget, you know, the budget's not final yet because the budget's approved by the state.
  149. 26:14And so we sent we provide a letter to you. I think that also got uploaded and one of the things that we said, we said, look,
  150. 26:20you know, [clears throat] the budget's going to be a public the budget is a public document. We're happy to share it with you once the state approves it. our challenge right now that we're that we want to be able to close our construction financing, break ground in the middle of 2026. This cooperation agreement is a necessary predicate for us to get there. Um the MCO team has been working on budgeting. Um they would like to get something out to the state. Um
  151. 26:50I'm trying to find the document. So, would you like to add anything?
  152. 27:05Honestly, I I don't know that I have much more to add than what Mr. Hubble has added. Um, I did go through I saw that there was, you know, this pre-existing agreement. It dates back to when Bliss Towers was originally um constructed, which I advised the the council of in the email today. um and that there was the 2019 um agreement that came in afterwards. With respect to the values that are being discussed um they h I mean they have been provided the $250 per unit um was disclosed in
  153. 27:39the initial documents to the council. Um, I don't have additional information to add to this. If there are specific concerns or questions that any of the council members have regarding, you know, these agreements or any of the documentation or information, I'm happy to dig into it. But without a specific question on that, I'm not sure that I could provide additional information.
  154. 28:07Thank you. You've seen most of the documents. Right.
  155. 28:15Dan, I got a quick question. So, how does it doesn't affect the structure of the fee base like the water and sewer or the newly sidewalk fee, right? How's that? That would be
  156. 28:26that's going to be right.
  157. 28:29No, the payment, you know, your water payment, right?
  158. 28:33Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like, yeah, that's a util that's a utility charge. Yeah.
  159. 28:38Yeah. Those Right. Yeah. Those ly pay water and sewer to as if we're fully occupied and we're not. We pay about 20,000 a quarter. [clears throat]
  160. 28:49It's a that's a separate plan.
  161. 28:52Now the sidewalk. Have you figured out how the sidewalk fee is going to work?
  162. 29:00I don't think they're in city. Okay.
  163. 29:05Not sure if they're they're going to be assessed. I don't even know. It would be a special district and I think generally speaking we still
  164. 29:16it's a infrastructure infrastructure.
  165. 29:19Yeah. It's not it's not an adalorum. It's not an adorum or or a benefit assessment. It was um designed um to work as a fee based on um the the frontage for the properties. whether there was an assessment for the incoming or the, you know, what we're looking at for 2026. I'd have to go back and and take a look to see how these properties were um looked at by the board.
  166. 29:48So, [clears throat] I would really like to [clears throat] Hi Morenzi.
  167. 30:05Hi.
  168. 30:07Hi.
  169. 30:08Morris.
  170. 30:09No. Hagen.
  171. 30:12Hi.
  172. 30:13Robert.
  173. 30:14Hi.
  174. 30:15Ronnie.
  175. 30:16Hi.
  176. 30:18Hi.
  177. 30:20President. All right. Carrie. Thank you everyone.
  178. 30:37Thank you.
  179. 30:41And thank you Mr.
  180. 30:52Okay, moving along new resolutions. The first one
  181. 30:57more space now if you wanted to.
  182. 31:02The first one approves planning board as lead to this very project. Can I have an introduction?
  183. 31:11Any questions?
  184. 31:19Council member Hi.
  185. 31:24Hi. Hi
  186. 31:27Morris.
  187. 31:28Hi
  188. 31:30Hi
  189. 31:31Roberts.
  190. 31:32Hi
  191. 31:33Ro.
  192. 31:34Hi
  193. 31:35Farmer.
  194. 31:35Hi
  195. 31:37Bolo. Hi
  196. 31:38President.
  197. 31:40Hi.
  198. 31:41The next resolution authorizes a lease agreement uh renewal actually more than renewal with the planning board. I'm sorry. Um questions. Oh, I'm sorry. Introduction a second, please.
  199. 31:59Yeah,
  200. 32:00Jennifer.
  201. 32:01And I can see you got it. [laughter]
  202. 32:11Any questions?
  203. 32:12I just want to make comments to thank Vicki for getting this done.
  204. 32:16Oh, you're welcome. And I want to thank and Mr. and the Jennifer and Margaret and everybody and I wanted to thank the climbing the pocketbook factor for doing such a beautiful job.
  205. 32:32I haven't explored the whole building.
  206. 32:34Uh I do think it's going to be a little convenient for the residents until you actually have the new parking area. And it's uh it's great that you're going to be renovating and making bigger until after that we're going to see things improving. But thank you so much for taking a building that was pretty much in a horrible condition. And
  207. 33:00did you get a tour? [laughter]
  208. 33:06Oh, yes, I did.
  209. 33:08Yeah.
  210. 33:09She had access. No, I just went I actually went there.
  211. 33:16Yeah,
  212. 33:16they're doing a ribbon cutting that we were all invited.
  213. 33:19Yeah, I saw
  214. 33:19it's probably going to be
  215. 33:21trying to stop by
  216. 33:22and drink on the house, right? [laughter]
  217. 33:29Always looking for the edge, you know.
  218. 33:30Yeah.
  219. 33:31Sounds reasonable to me.
  220. 33:33The best one, please. [laughter]
  221. 33:37I'm going to the Argentine restaurant. I don't care. Move over questions or comments.
  222. 33:44Thank you for having a conversation with me.
  223. 33:50Council member Bell.
  224. 33:51Hi.
  225. 33:53Hi.
  226. 33:55Hi.
  227. 33:56Hi Morris.
  228. 33:58Hi. Hi
  229. 34:01Roberts. Hi Ronnie. Hi S. Hi. Hi President. Hi Barry. Thank you.
  230. 34:13Thank you, Sean. Uh, next resolution some trans introduction. A second question. These are um there's typical end of the year trans.
  231. 34:44Hi.
  232. 34:45Hi.
  233. 34:47Hi.
  234. 34:49Hi Morris.
  235. 34:51Hi
  236. 34:52Khagen.
  237. 34:53Hi
  238. 34:54Roberts. Hi
  239. 34:56Ro.
  240. 34:57Hi.
  241. 34:58Hi.
  242. 35:00Hi President Carries. The next resolution authorizes an application for a grant um for the technical assistance to grow. Can I do introduction a second please and [clears throat] questions?
  243. 35:24Yeah, I have a question. So, um I think is it for 200,000 or no it's not. Is it 200,000? Yeah, I saw it somewhere. And we don't have to match it. Okay. So that
  244. 35:36and what uh what uh is this going to be used for?
  245. 35:41Zoning
  246. 35:43the zonings.
  247. 35:44Yeah. So we applied for um a grant for zoning this summer from DOS. It's from an HDR. We don't know if we won the DOS one yet. The DOS one yet. is that if we win both, we could just modify if we don't need all that money. But if we win both, we have a little more money on hand in case the zoning, you know, the proposals are more than we have with 200. So,
  248. 36:12do you have any idea where it can be used?
  249. 36:15No. So, it's to do like a zoning study to update our zoning.
  250. 36:20Okay.
  251. 36:20Yeah.
  252. 36:21Which was it needs to be done?
  253. 36:23Which was Yeah, that's part of what the comprehensive plan.
  254. 36:26Okay. more updated more also. We're trying to digitize a lot of it. We could like look online like what what are zoning things like
  255. 36:38so do you think we have a chance of getting this?
  256. 36:40I think so. It's a brand new grant. They rolled it out in like we haven't done it before community and every application, you know, there's no match. So I think
  257. 36:51Yeah. Roll.
  258. 37:00Council member Delta.
  259. 37:01I hi
  260. 37:07hi
  261. 37:08Morris.
  262. 37:09Hi.
  263. 37:11Hi. [clears throat]
  264. 37:12Robert.
  265. 37:13Hi.
  266. 37:14Romy.
  267. 37:15Hi. Thank you Michelle for seeking that. Hi
  268. 37:20Bola. Hi. President DPra. Hi Car.
  269. 37:25[clears throat]
  270. 37:29Um the next resolution this is the next resolution comes from the uh thank you all you all the historic preservation commission and it's a resolution to declare the warehouse historic can I have an introduction of second please
  271. 37:53I'll introduce
  272. 37:54Margaret and range. Um, I'd like to say that uh, you know, the D warehouse has been a a difficult building for the city to develop. Remember back when when uh, when council was prepared to sell it to the Gin Foundation? um in the first round uh with the RFP that we sent out and we picked a uh a uh developer, they of course were prepared to go before Shibbo, which is the state historic preservation office as well as the National Register of Historic Places. We have three
  273. 38:38um proposals before us right now before um uh us uh responses to the latest RFP request for proposals. All of which intend to go before ship and the landmark and to seek out a national landmark. I'm telling you all this because I think this effort is redundant and just creates another layer layer of bureaucracy in the process of developing the dog warehouse which has not been easy will continue to be difficult. So um
  274. 39:16uh I'm open to
  275. 39:17I have a comment I have a comment. So uh when Don and Dun were trying to do their development, they went through the ship process. So the building has already received a ship approval as eligible for listing. So that that phase of it has been done. Uh what this does and what the u there are a couple of hands raised from the performance. What this does is it provides uh protections to the building to local protections chip is how you would get monies through the state for funding for
  276. 39:54for uh a historic
  277. 39:58landmark building. Right. So that piece is going to be very important for the developers. Uh but this also provides assurance that anything that is being done will go have to go before the historic preservation commission so that it provides a protection for the building that it doesn't currently have. And so I I would strongly recommend that you uh vote in favor of this. Um I know that [clears throat] has time for you're not running the meeting once again marker. They don't go next. They go after the council.
  278. 40:32I just saw that,
  279. 40:33sir. First of all, you're incorrect, but they they have to reapply the shipo. Secondly, shipo does provide about the status of the building. And if you've been in the building, you know that whoever deals with it is going to have a difficult time. And that what the historic will do really doesn't affect that process much at all. And I I have open up to the council there. And again what I say it just means another level another delay in the process of getting this building.
  280. 41:04Are you saying passing this resolution will be
  281. 41:09it would hamper the process?
  282. 41:10I think so. Yes.
  283. 41:11So what [clears throat]
  284. 41:14by putting historical uh um restrictions on it
  285. 41:19from local restrictions restrictions right
  286. 41:22which by the way are not going to any different. So, this is uh Okay, I see where the applic I mean, as soon as we arrive to the city and that's what you see. It's there's nothing wrong to ask them to preserve it and do it as, you know, a thorough job as possible. I mean, what is the delay? It's going to be what next? It's it's another layer already. Oh
  287. 41:58I just
  288. 41:59Excuse me.
  289. 42:00I'm done.
  290. 42:02Okay.
  291. 42:05Would not the historical uh status uh make the property more attractive?
  292. 42:13It will. And they're both going for that. I mean, the two layers that we've already talked about in the um the landmark and the shipo would already establish all of it and prevent it from being, [clears throat] you know, whatever it would pretend.
  293. 42:31So, so what you're saying is that landmark status uh in in fact o overwhelms the historical status
  294. 42:42overhelms redundant. It's redundant. That's what I'm see. And the time
  295. 42:49you don't think that's the case, Margaret? It's not redundant because um remember folks most of War Street is under historical preservation. Um that hasn't stopped any you know development that hasn't you know um well but that hasn't really stopped this if anything has preserved the integrity of the town throughout the years. Um so I yeah I'm in favor of this and that that you know Yes, historic preservation has done a fantastic job of preserving as does shipo and national status.
  296. 43:29Can I comment on
  297. 43:32so the protection that I see
  298. 43:35is that yes there is this future process of going through getting uh state recognition and so forth. However, we actually have and the HBC has recommended that this be that and only the council can designate this. The HBC cannot. They have recommended that we do this because that provides an immediate protection for the mil building. So, we don't know what's going to happen, how it's going to shape up what's going to happen with the state designation, but this gives the city some um control and authority over protecting building
  299. 44:12right away. So, clarifying just from my own understanding. So the proponents you guys are saying that this designation would give a layer of protection from the city perspective to but
  300. 44:26right from what I understand the historic preservation committee wouldn't be that right it wouldn't be the council itself
  301. 44:34u the way it stands right now every time an RFP project goes through it's still the council that has
  302. 44:40correct the ability to impose protections
  303. 44:44but we do not we do not enter into we have to qualify ations that the HBC has to look at architectural integrity. So we would approve a project and say yeah put on the same we we go with this developer whatever but the HBC has a level of uh expertise that
  304. 45:03whoever is approving it from the council
  305. 45:06excuse me
  306. 45:06will be able I speak will be able to demand that it you know go before historic go before shipo and the national
  307. 45:16right when we go through the process we can process we need you to get an okay from Okay. Um, if there are public would like to speak, I don't know who was up first. I
  308. 45:28I thought he was still, but Okay, Ron, we have your letter. So, we
  309. 45:33Thank you. Uh,
  310. 45:36can you hear me?
  311. 45:37Yes, we can.
  312. 45:38I would just like to make a few remarks in response to what I've just heard. Uh, first of all, I'm very sorry that the plan of done and done uh to lease the building fell through. I can't explain the reasons for it. Unfortunately, it happened. It is not the fact that local designation is redundant with respect to national recognition and recognition by Shipo. It gives a more immediate protection to the building particularly in protecting it from potential demolition. uh and it gives a more immediate and granular method of regulation which can
  313. 46:21respond quickly to to changes in in the plans for the building. I find it very ironic that the council president is wondering and worrying about delay. It is not the fault of this particular administration, but this building frankly should have had Shipo and national recognition long ago. It should have been designated as a as a landmark of the city of Hudson or at least included in a historic district long ago. There has been delay and delay and delay and to worry about delay now I it strikes me as as somewhat ironic. Uh
  314. 47:01I would also note for the record that at the meeting of the uh historic preservation commission at which that there was supposed to be a vote on the uh the designation of the building there but because of a delay in notification of the city it didn't happen. Mr. Weaver the mayoral aid declared that the city supported designation. And and finally, as I said in my email, I would like to know I would like for the administration to confirm the membership of the committee which is meeting to respond to the three RFPs
  315. 47:40which apparently have been received. And I would like to call upon that committee in accordance with the open meetings law to conduct its meetings in public. And now [clears throat] Matt McGee would like to make a statement if he may.
  316. 47:56Yes. I would like to point out that the building
  317. 48:02we can't hear you. I would like to point out that the building has uh not been as far as I understand it only applied for protection from this the state and that has not been done as far as I understand. And I also would like to point out a crucial distinction between the protections that the state offers and that the city offers. Uh in the case of demolition uh when the state is protecting it, all you have to do is get a permit and tear it down.
  318. 48:44The thing that can the consequence you may suffer which is optional is that you will not be granted any funds for rebuilding. Uh that that is it. If you accept funds for having work uh for doing this work then it will be supervised by the state but otherwise it you and even in the middle of all this you can walk off from it and tear it down. So this is there's no equality here in what the state and the city can do because the city absolutely can block
  319. 49:26tearing it down and that makes a huge difference. The other thing
  320. 49:35I I haven't finished. The other thing I would like to say is that when buildings have been landmarked in my experience for more than 40 years I've been following landmarks. I started in New York City and I met I met with the coun with the commission there and and I spoke at their meetings and I very experienced in all of this and it raises the value of properties every time. The next thing I would like to say is a statement which I wrote for you today
  321. 50:19of the Democratic Vista on the Hudson River waterfront with the Dun Warehouse as its centerpiece greatly enhances its beauty and is an asset of us all. It is the that is the people of Hudson and deserves to be given landmark status by the city of Hudson. Thank you.
  322. 50:52Thank you. Um Bill Foreman, would you like to speak next? Can't hear you yourself. I can't just pay for what is
  323. 51:20you want to take do you want to take Justin while you're waiting for
  324. 51:24Justin no No.
  325. 51:35Better or worse?
  326. 51:37Oh, there you go.
  327. 51:39Can you hear me at all?
  328. 51:41Yes, now we can.
  329. 51:42Oh, thank you. I apologize for that. Uh I'm a little more used to Zoom. Anyway, thank you for uh giving me a couple minutes of your time. I think that the um some of the language in this designation is kind of misleading uh landmark and I I want to come back to that. Uh so I'm going to start with one thought
  330. 52:11that if you all believe that there is uh community interest uh in the waterfront and community interest in the buildings on the waterfront, this building specifically, the Dun warehouse, then as from the city's perspective, my perspective anyway, you don't have another option If this building had been in one of the historic districts, we wouldn't have to go through all this rigomearroll. And the normal course of business for buildings in the historic district, if they want to do some exterior work that's at all significant, they go to Craig. They come to us with the same
  331. 52:58material that would have been provided to Craig basically uh of engineering plans and specifications and I don't get the word delay. We process 60 cases a year. We run most of our cases in four weeks. Uh, if this came before us, maybe it might take six because we're going to throw in a public hearing or two, [clears throat] but the building is not in the historic district. Therefore, if you want local folks participating in reviewing the exterior structure of whatever the developer comes up, probably people are going to want to put in some windows and some more light. they might want to build an annex. Uh we went through this process
  332. 53:50with the opera house. Uh it did not take forever. It went very quickly and they also had Shipo on their side. But Shipo does not guarantee local involvement. We are local involvement. We're seven people from Hudson. We have a very clear process of reviewing the external bits of the building. It does not take a lot of time, but it ensures that Hudson has a voice in what happens. The alternative is you can move on without the designation. The building will probably almost certainly get sold to a developer and
  333. 54:32Hudson may or may not have a voice in the process. What we put on the table through the through historic preservation is a careful scrutiny. It goes by extremely quickly. A public exposure of what the builder is proposing on the exterior of the building. And the participation of our group, which is pretty darn good, it includes an architect, a historian. We don't stop projects. We help people get into compliance with chapter 169. We don't interfere with anything that anybody's doing. Craig Heg participates in what we're doing. So, you get a two for one. Uh, not only do you get a
  334. 55:21historic review of the exterior features of the building, you get one more run at making sure that everything that's going on is safe and building code. And we do that together with Craig. I cannot see any one bad thing about this and I can't see why we don't got four or six weeks to do this right and to expose the public to the exterior of the building as it evolves from the developer and let them put their thoughts into play in front of our commission.
  335. 55:54Thank you, Phil. And don't think that what I've said is in any way a criticism of HBC. I think you do a phenomenal job and have done a phenomenal job for many years. Um to your comment about community, I'm not sure you're aware that this was this whole project and the development of Dun has gone through lots of community comment during the last round. Um so had had a lot of that being said, you know, let's hear from Justin Weaver who also has his hand up.
  336. 56:27Hi, can you hear me? Yes.
  337. 56:31Yes. Uh, first I want to give credit to Phil Foreman and the HPC. I've had the privilege to sit in the last few of the HPC meetings as it relates to this. Um, one of their meetings became Looney Tunes um, over this topic which um, Phil handled wonderfully. Um, I just want to comment to Ronald Copniki's statement about how I mentioned that the city is fully in support of this historical designation. Um, which is true and you know, I wanted to make that clear. Um, as the representative from the city and
  338. 57:11I was, you know, in full support because we've dealt with Shipo and the state historical res um his uh designation of the building. So all all along we've been in support of any historical designation. Um there have been local outlets that have made it seem as though we're rushing this along since the previous um uh developers fell through. They didn't have enough money to, you know, continue. We put out a new RFP. To some folks, it seemed as though we were rushing to get this done. Um, but a lot
  339. 57:52of people don't know how long this has been in play. Um, and then there was this panic like we have to hurry up and and make this locally designated, which I'm wondering why nobody else cared about making this locally designated historical when the previous developer had it and why all of a sudden there's this interest. Um, and I'd also like Margaret to speak on um the fact that she brought up uh that the million dollars vanished from the DUN project when they had it. Um, she made that a huge point
  340. 58:36in both HPC meetings and I had to make it clear that it, you know, it went to another uh city project, HHA. Um, so but that hasn't been mentioned tonight. So I'm just curious why that was mentioned at HBC and not here tonight. That's all. Thank you.
  341. 58:57Would you like to respond?
  342. 58:58Yeah, I have no comment on that. Just talk about the designation.
  343. 59:01Okay. So, um, okay. Uh,
  344. 59:09Tom, I just want to pay tribute to my mother, daughters, Kate Teddy. She's a very active in the Star Preservation, a member of the National Landmark Society. I grew up with the Star Preservation [clears throat] in my household week in and week out. She moved to church. My mom moved to church in Clonesville four miles to a property. All right. So, this is why historic preservation the people that are and God rest their soul. I think that this this council is going to pass this if for no one else but for you. So having said that and paying
  345. 59:53tribute to my mom rightfully so. Even Robert Redford knew my mom's name. So anyway, Tom, I want to pay tribute to Tom also while we're here. He runs his his meetings. Phil, you were two of the most superlative meeting runners I've ever seen. Anyway, let me make the point quickly here.
  346. 1:00:13That was the point.
  347. 1:00:14[laughter]
  348. 1:00:17Sorry. So, as someone who's been going, I am getting to the point, but I had to do the tribute. Okay.
  349. 1:00:24And Tom certainly deserves a tribute because he's been here for six years and he's been running this this operation and putting up with this hurting these cats and getting it all done. Yeah. I gota go. [laughter]
  350. 1:00:38So, anyway, moving on. Moving on and getting to the to the issue at hand that I would like to speak to directly. So, Bill does a wonderful job of running the HPC. The HPC is the one council committee that run that meets twice a month. Twice a month. I don't know if does anyone else speak twice a month here? So, they get these things done and I've seen them. I've been to how many meetings have I been to, Phil? You know,
  351. 1:01:05too many council also. [laughter] So what I'd like to say is this designation be
  352. 1:01:14okay
  353. 1:01:14I eat a dinner now. Okay. So what I'd like to say is that this this designation doesn't interfere with these three proposals but these three proposals could disappear and what this will do is assure that the building doesn't get condemned or destroyed and that was Ron's point and I think Matt that that guy was and he made a very good point right and I and I concur and
  354. 1:01:45okay Okay.
  355. 1:01:52The report come out. I'll be done in a minute. It was a tribute to you that took all the time. Anyway, so I would like to see this designation put in place. It does no harm. The HPC will move. Okay? And it only protects the building. If if you're okay with it being demolished, then don't move this proposal. But if you want to keep it, you want to have the building preserved, then move on.
  356. 1:02:18Okay. Thank you.
  357. 1:02:21There's one more.
  358. 1:02:23I think we got enough. Let's just vote.
  359. 1:02:28I I object. I had my voting.
  360. 1:02:35Council member Bel. That's alluding to Mari. I think it's important that we keep a layer of local uh influences and opinions on this uh anything historic. I
  361. 1:02:51Mason [clears throat] Warren.
  362. 1:02:53Hi.
  363. 1:02:55Hi,
  364. 1:02:56Robert.
  365. 1:02:57Hi. [clears throat]
  366. 1:03:02[sighs]
  367. 1:03:05I I don't I don't see the real need for it, but I'm gonna I'm just gonna abstain because doesn't make sense to me. But yeah,
  368. 1:03:15sorry.
  369. 1:03:23In memory of Ly's mother.
  370. 1:03:24You stole my life. [laughter]
  371. 1:03:27Should I try to say something else or should I leave it?
  372. 1:03:31[laughter]
  373. 1:03:32Yes. Say it or
  374. 1:03:34memory of his mother also.
  375. 1:03:36I will vote.
  376. 1:03:37Thank you.
  377. 1:03:38My mom appreciates it.
  378. 1:03:42Okay. [laughter]
  379. 1:03:49And now the common council moves your mother's name.
  380. 1:03:53I was gonna respond to what weaver said.
  381. 1:03:55So it was done.
  382. 1:03:56Yeah.
  383. 1:03:59Could you mute yourself? Mute yourself please Mr. Cupi.
  384. 1:04:02Okay.
  385. 1:04:04Moving along to the next resolution. This author as a budget amendment to cover um writer cost. Can I have an introduction? A second please
  386. 1:04:21questions. Call please.
  387. 1:04:26Council member Belton.
  388. 1:04:28Hi.
  389. 1:04:30Hi.
  390. 1:04:31Moranti.
  391. 1:04:32Hi.
  392. 1:04:33Misan.
  393. 1:04:33Hi
  394. 1:04:34Morris.
  395. 1:04:35Hi
  396. 1:04:37hi
  397. 1:04:38Roberts.
  398. 1:04:39Hi
  399. 1:04:40Ro.
  400. 1:04:41Hi
  401. 1:04:42S.
  402. 1:04:43Hi [clears throat]
  403. 1:04:47here. This next resolution concerning water and sewer rent agreeers. Can I have an introduction a second first please? Who I know um you can speak to this directly please.
  404. 1:05:09Heather, are you there?
  405. 1:05:12Yeah, I'm here. I'm sorry. Can you put the resolution back up? Is this just the annual relevy of the water sewer,
  406. 1:05:18right?
  407. 1:05:19Yeah.
  408. 1:05:20Sorry. Just in case.
  409. 1:05:23Yeah. So, basically every year um the water department determines who has outstanding water and sewer bills and they are relevied um as of the uh third quarter. So, everything up to October of 2025 that is outstanding will be relevied onto the tax bills. one quarter um the first quarter has either water or sewer and the second quarter has the the other. Uh city's been doing it for longer than I've been here.
  410. 1:05:54Okay.
  411. 1:05:57Any questions in council member?
  412. 1:06:01Hi.
  413. 1:06:03Hi.
  414. 1:06:05Hi.
  415. 1:06:06Hi Morris.
  416. 1:06:08Hi.
  417. 1:06:09Hi Robert.
  418. 1:06:11Hi
  419. 1:06:12Browning. Hi
  420. 1:06:14Sar.
  421. 1:06:15Hi.
  422. 1:06:16Hi.
  423. 1:06:18Hi.
  424. 1:06:19And the last resolution concerns a our council council budget is to say the lawyer for the council. Um an introduction of second place and a number.
  425. 1:06:39Council member Bell. Hi
  426. 1:06:43Moranti.
  427. 1:06:44Hi
  428. 1:06:45M.
  429. 1:06:45Hi
  430. 1:06:46Morris. Hi
  431. 1:06:49Hi
  432. 1:06:50Roberts.
  433. 1:06:50Hi
  434. 1:06:52Ro.
  435. 1:06:54Hi.
  436. 1:06:56Hi. [clears throat]
  437. 1:06:58Hi.
  438. 1:07:01Can I have an introduction second to pay the bills and questions? We posted there yet? Okay. Roll call.
  439. 1:07:26Council member Belton.
  440. 1:07:27Hi.
  441. 1:07:28Descoragen.
  442. 1:07:36Hi.
  443. 1:07:38Hi.
  444. 1:07:39Hi. Okay. Um, no business.
  445. 1:08:01Yeah. One business.
  446. 1:08:02Yes, sir. Well, I just want to recognize you, Tom, all that you've done and just [laughter] motion. Yes. Second favor. Last week.

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