Common Council Safety Committee transcript: FUTURE HUDSON

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0:05almost 5:30 I guess. Oh yeah. Oh. All right. Great. Well, it is 5:30 and we will begin the safety committee meeting. Um present we have myself, Councilman Henry Had, and we have and Dominic and Claire in attendance. And we've got safety officer Nick and Chief Franklin. And I uh Nick, your fire department tonight. Thanks.
0:40Captain Miller.
0:42Um Nick, would you like to take it away? Sure. And when we release you, make it quick.
0:47Yeah.
0:48All right. So, for the month of July, we answered 69 calls for service. Um 29 28 of those were Wednesday morning between the hours of 6 and 6:00 a.m. and I think really stopped about
1:0911:30 12:00
1:12for the water uh for the rain all the water problems.
1:16It rained
1:17just just just a little bit. It wasn't terrible. Um, so that was that was the big one for the month, but even without those, we still did 39 calls. Besides that, um, three structure fire calls. One was at Hudson was a garage. It was actually one of our numbers. Um, was a, uh, lithium ion battery charging out in the garage. Um, so that was that. It was contained to the garage. Um,
1:48electric scooter, you'd say it.
1:50It was not a scooter.
1:53It was a bike. I think it was a bike. It was not a scooter.
1:55Okay. Not a scooter.
1:56Um, surprisingly that's been the first one we've had in city.
2:01Um, so that I can recall. Um, we went to Filmont for a structure fire. Uh, in the middle of the rainstorm, we got dispatched to Catskill for a structure fire. Um, I think we went to a couple other ones too, but they might be uh let's say something else. We had four hazardous situations. Gas leaks, carbon monoxide or electrifying down. Uh, one cardiac arrest. So, that was our first one that I think Sean talked about last month. It was actually in the month of July though. Um, that we responded to
2:36with arrest squad which was a reversal. Um, no emergency. So, false alarms, malfunctioning alarms, accidental smoke, cooking, um stuff like that. 23 alarms, 36 public service that includes the waterfalls. Um we had one building collapse on Columbia Street on Friday into the old building at uh 225 and a half. Um and one ele stuck elevator at Providence as well on Friday. Um yeah, it it was a it was very busy month. Uh we are on pace right now. We're at 275 calls for the year as of
3:29this morning. 278 actually to be exact. Um so we're on pace for about 450 again, which is where we were in 2020 report. if it keeps this up. So, um that's that. The five of us went out to Buffalo 3 weeks ago, um to look at the new truck. It is still in Buffalo. Um we're hoping it's in Albany in the next couple of weeks. There were some things that needed to get fixed that were found, which is why we do the final inspections. um stuff that needed to get done at the
4:09factory, not done by our salespeople. Um so I spoke with them today. Uh big portion of the list has been knocked out. They're still working on it. Um we're hoping to have better answer this week and a better timeline. So all right. Um that's that. Um, the boat has been moved to the city dock, the city commercial dock down at the waterfront. Um, I won't get into why. Um, that's conversation for another day. Um, but we'll be participating in waterfront Wednesday this week. I spoke with Sam.
4:58um he's actually been a good help helping us out giving us the spot. So I think over the winter um before the when all of that those contracts are up for renewal um hopefully the city we can put something in there that you know the fire department will occupy 30 ft of that dock um since it is a city dock and just get it in that wording that that will be allowed to that will be our spot. All right, let's see how it goes.
5:34See what it
5:36uh any questions from the council members? The garage fire that the lithium battery. So you said it was not an ebike. What?
5:45It it wasn't a scooter. I think it was a bike. It was some sort of bike. Um electric bike,
5:51but it wasn't like a scooter. I think it was pedal assist bike. There was couple of them. One was plugged in.
6:00Um, so
6:02because I'm wondering if we should incorporate something when we do any of these safety things about ebikes or whatever regarding this because this actually is the second time that I've heard of the lithium batteries doing something like that.
6:16I think we should because I think there is like a proper way. I mean, it's it's not that it it's there is a proper way, but the other problem is people buy junk offline
6:29and that's what they're getting.
6:31Um or they're buying junk replacement batteries that aren't made for the chargers they're getting.
6:36Um there's a million different reasons. Again, this was one of our members who he's a life member of the department. He he's very knowledgeable in stuff like that and it's it h it still happened. It it's and he's very cautious on the stuff he bought and replacement parts and when it's plugged in and you just don't know. He's like
7:02even like language around like you know just like safety precautions like if you smell something like there's a difference in like an electrical fire and like you know traditional fires like knowing the difference or like maybe some of that new information just like reiterated.
7:17Yeah. I mean the nice part was it was out in the garage. It wasn't in the like in the house
7:23or in the apartment.
7:25It was plugged in. Right.
7:26It was it was plugged in. It was turned.
7:29But as a detachable garage. Yeah, it was a detached garage and I I know not everybody has that right that luxury.
7:36Um, but you know, luckily it was outside. It wasn't in his basement. And you know, when we got there, he's like, "This is why I don't even put it in my basement cuz it's just
7:48Well, again, that's because he has, you know, he has,
7:51right? But my fear is those who don't and don't have a garage, right? And, you know, I mean, I've guilty of myself,
7:58right?
7:59And uh and don't have any other place to put it. That's all like
8:02exactly,
8:03you know, and that's we've been fortunate enough in the city to not have um those amount of fires. But you look at these different You look at New York City, I pay attention to their fire and it's lithium battery fire after lithium batteries
8:24and it's not bikes or lawnmowers and trimmers. Yeah. Everything everything's a lithium ion battery now.
8:31Yeah.
8:34Yeah.
8:36Yep. So it's it's it's difficult, right? You can say, "Yeah, it's ebikes, but it's not just ebikes and scooters. It's it's your power your newer power tool. Lawnmowers are now electric. They're always weed whackers,
8:50blowers, every you name it, they're making it a car."
8:54Yeah. No. Yeah. And and honestly some we're again fortunate enough that we haven't had an issue with an electric car but we don't have to stop a electric car fire is very very very difficult. They don't have any equipment for electric water, but they take so much water and they also reignite. You can you could think you have it out and tow truck takes it and the next day it's on fire in the tow truck. I've seen that. Yeah. Not here, but it's all possible. Just
9:29takes
9:29We have a lot of electric vehicle in our city.
9:33Just a lot of water.
9:35Really a lot of water.
9:36This cat too, right? Yeah, make different things.
9:40A different kind of fire extinguisher for the electric vehicle.
9:45Once one of those electric vehicles gets going, the fire extinguisher is not funed out.
9:49Our apartment is not going to push.
9:50Yeah. Down in New York City, they when they bring them to the impound lot, they have containers filled with water and they just throw them in the water
10:00and leave them there for days. consultant.
10:04I could bring it down to the water treatment facility and tell us today. Uh well, thank you, Nick. Um thanks for being prepared and any other questions for fire online in the room. Excellent. Well, thank you very much. Uh have a good evening. Um, next before we get to HPD, we have a presentation from the ASC group. Exactly.
10:34Thank you. Um, introduced by Claire and please welcome. Uh, tell us a little bit about your organization, please. And
10:44I'm going to give some context. Our last meeting we had we were having a conversation about mobile crisis and I had asked the question um if there were any partnerships with this new service pastor services which has crisis intervention for young people. Um, so part of me bringing them so that they can explain what services are currently available and maybe we could start to think of ways that we could partner in the future if mobile price is not available to avoid emergency room stops for families um if that is a possibility
11:19and just sort of really work together on some crisis intervention solutions. Before you start, I did have a meeting with um the new superintendent today and he specifically asked if there was any crisis intervention for youth. Um so this is a probably a good segue because he wants to partner more with us um and just how we can increase safety and like that sort of crisis response for students. That's good. some time for $100 on their website. So I'm just standing on this a little less than two years ago
12:14already. Um for both counties there clinicians with fields in 6 to9 it's an invasive shortterm program. It's about six weeks. We do two sessions a week in the home or in community or at school whatever works for the situation. And um the sessions are about an hour and a half each. So that's three hours of therapy that they're getting a week. On top of that, we offer 247 help um where parents could call or caregivers and get the phone coach checking for crisis um that they're experienc.
13:12So our goal of a round is to prevent alcohol basement from constituting stations or residential placements the voluntary program. So the kid and the parents or the caregivers have to commit to that intensive program and engage. Um sessions can be broken up between like the individual for the youth family sessions and parent session for book and build in their skills. Um we do behavioral health assessments screenings and treatment treatment planning. We do a lot of referrals to make sure that they're connected to supports for ongoing success.
14:14Um the idea of this is they get to the youth before they start going to the ER. Um I also work at the memorial hospital and ER. So really want to get to know them prior. So I was seeing those early warning signs at school in the community. There's been two falls in one house within a short period of time. Um it's easier to intervene at that point. Um we work on dialectical behavior therapy. This program is in aer it's in form of green bice offer and rock counties. We work with five
15:15years to 20 and we will work with youth that have autism and other intellectual and developmental disabilities. A lot of times it's very difficult finding services for that population. um and we will do that. This is a free service. No health insurance is needed. It is fully funded by um office of mental health in New York State and our success rate um by doing this work directly with families and youth in their home environments. were able to prevent psychiatric hospitalization out of home placement in more than 90% of the families that we
16:04serve.
16:10Question. You said you can do six to eight families at once for the four to eight four to six weeks.
16:18Overall for the two counties for Columbia and Green there's three clinicians. So all together,
16:25yes,
16:26we can be working with six to nine families at one time. Um
16:33if you're working with a family, do they have to be in this um HBCI in order to get 24-hour support or they do? So if something were to happen, say in the school um and a student is obviously in crisis and the option is to go to the hospital, we couldn't contact you. They would have to go to the hospital first. No. So we are emoling this program. So if the student be programs work and would also say it was me and if I was available I could go to the school and I could do a a safety plan a risk
17:15assessment and assess them at school. saying if there's a crisis somebody not
17:21like there's actually a crisis you as like an institute as a school as a police officer could be only risk of being hospitalized
17:29we would only be able to do a referral post hospitalization
17:35I mean this is this is not a dig I think that's the missing piece that we have right it's like how do we provide those services without that initial response like trip to the hospital or out of placement
17:47evaluation Right.
17:49I think that those early morning times when a kid is getting to that level
17:56and when they're to that level like if the superintendent and administrations are all on the same page like they can do a referral
18:04and we start fairly quickly as long as we have openings.
18:09Okay.
18:09Um to have to be enrolled in the program.
18:12So how quick is that in the program? like if there's something going on uh in that moment, you're we couldn't call you up and say, "Hey, we think we have somebody that might need your attention."
18:25It's it depends. So, it could happen like that. All essentials you have, is there current openings?
18:37Typically, when we get a referral, we need to be within the home 3 days. within three days do a safety plan risk assessment.
18:46Okay.
18:47So there has been times where we worked with CH where we did the initial paperwork when they were still in the ER so they left what that's important. So I just want to share an anecdotally as a parent with a child with autism who's been through psychiatric hospitalization and has had moments where I'm calling for crisis intervention but isn't necessarily rising to needing to go to the hospital. there's such a gap in services that I mean this is where we get creative like it might not be the system now but if we're identifying that this is the gap
19:25maybe there's room I know you know you will partner with commissioner um Gibson and Dan Alasi and at the county level they are very open to figuring out what is the the stop gap um and I think at safety committee like we we have folks like you who are also involved and the school is involved so like maybe we need to create a system of what is that next step cuz mobile crisis has existed for a long time and there's a bigger gap in services than intended
19:54um with mobile crisis. So I think this is a first step of like here is an alternative to a mobile crisis that exists. Now what is the walk back to that moment of crisis intervention? But I will say um had this been around before my son was first hospitalized he would not have been hospitalized because there were the warning side. There were the school meetings then there were the community meetings and then he got to the point of no intervention and needing to be hospitalized. So it is still a
20:25really huge step and advantage for parents who are trying to figure out what what can I even do. I think the school would be a great partner for for that
20:34because I mean once you guys are involved it's already there. Yeah.
20:38Have officer, we have our SRO there, right? So you can also pick up on those things and then if anyone is speaking to a counselor within the district or um a guidance counselor or just staff could pick up on those things. And I think I think even a step further with the department though is that like there are those polls that y'all get where you're responding to families in crisis and you know there's not necessarily besides a mobile crisis poll any resources beyond that to be shared. So I think this is
21:10so so recognize before it gets to the escalation of the emergency room. the prior the quicker you can get involved in terms of escalating to the yard the better. Right? So is there kind of like um some kind of outline saying hey if you recognize A B and C before it gets to C give us a call right please can you have some kind of
21:39like conversations start talking like on the school level if you're starting to talk about residential school placement therapeutic school placement as far as parents if they're starting to fall please um help for the kids.
22:00Well, I think that that's what happens, right? Sometimes there are things that happen in the home and we're the first call and parents are at like it's usually when they're at their wits end, right? And they're not and they don't always go to the ER. That's the thing. Like that call could be. So on the flyer, Dominic says youth must be at risk of out of home placement um due to one of the following. unable to be safe with themselves and or others, unable to function in the homeschooler community.
22:27So like those are the like those are referral points.
22:30I can I can send this to the superintendent too and see if they can push that out to families and parents so that they have the information so they know like hey our first call doesn't have to be or our last like step doesn't have to be the police. It can be this first and then see.
22:48Now you said that OM and OPWD now if they're already involved in waiver add-on program or does it exclude they're already involved as a waiver?
23:00No, we can it doesn't exclude anything. We don't bill insurance. So it doesn't matter if the kid has the waiverss through orange or OP we could join in sometimes
23:16their standard therapy gets put on pause because that would be a lot that would be like 4 hours of therapy to leave. Um, but sometimes they can say this. It just depends on what the kid and the families can do. But it's a very flexible program too. So if it's four to six weeks for working with someone with a developmental disability, we give it extension for up to eight. And then there's this full postmission period of 30 days to where the families still have access to a call and the
24:02clinician to do sessions as needed.
24:06So you said it's voluntary. So, so is could this be used as like for example an alternative uh to what Claire was saying if things like that as you know to prevent abandoned but as an alternative for suspension or things like that could this be used the program since it's not fair
24:27no
24:27I don't think so because we don't want it to be pure in any way
24:34you know so I think it families was signed up for it and the school was going to let some behaviors try that would be on them. But
24:46like that would just be
24:48and again if they sign up as an attorney doesn't mean it's going to work, right? Because now they're they're committing to something that they're just trying to prevent, right? And rather than voluntarily saying, "Yeah, we need this help." Right? It's more um on them needing knowing they need to help and know beneficial rather than using it like you said where
25:12it's it's just spending it on rather than working.
25:18Yeah. I'm doing this for almost two years. the majority, a lot of the times we're working more with the parents than with the parents um to like how can they increase their tolerance with keeping the kids safe and you know it's very short term and it's focused on safety and a lot of times it just when crisis happen you're not connected anymore as a family and it just allows us to slow down and to really help with them and to get some longer term because how many volunteer it's a volunteer like whoever work
26:01participate in a volunteer
26:02the families like voluntarily agree to do the program it's not mandated okay hospitalization can be involuntary but this is
26:12they they have to have some level of engagement um so if the kid wants and the parents don't want to engage a lot more kids while it was still trying to get the parents to engage. So, there's a lot of flexibility in that um which is needed.
26:34Great.
26:36Thank you. Any other questions?
26:39Any questions online?
26:43Well, thank you very much for coming. Um, I'm assuming we'll get an update from the chief and the superintendent. See if there's give you some extra work.
26:54Yeah, get in touch with me and support.
27:00Thank you very much. Appreciate it.
27:03Thank you.
27:06Great. My resources here.
27:08Yeah. Um
27:09I mean he seemed very open to like crisis intervention and
27:14more tools, right?
27:16Yeah.
27:17There's no more Blue Bull Hawk Academy this year. So um there's probably going to be a need for that and they were talking about trying to get the Carheel program funded a little bit more because they partner I think with the youth center also and the district or after school program. Um that's also another like mental health service for students. Um, so there's a lot a lot happened in the back. It was important because there often feels like city government is so far removed from what is
27:48available and happening. And I, you know, I feel like there are often lots of opinions on the youth of the city without knowing what's actually available to support families. Yeah, I've recently just found out about the cartwheel program. And it's it's a shame because right I think if we had interactions with any students who were involved in that or in need of that service, we could have reached out to the district and said, "Hey, we had so and so this family and if they're able to use uh take advantage of this program within when they're at school or after school program, whatever, like please refer them or
28:26whatever." But we haven't had that communication about it in the past.
28:31So unfortunately,
28:32and there is a committee um it's called co-host for out of school time uh community partners. I sit on it in like multiple capacities, but I feel like somebody from the safety committee could probably benefit from spending some of their time as a city official um listening into those meetings and seeing what's happening with all the programs because there are things that come out of that committee like um at one point there was a diversion a diversion group that would meet specifically about youth in their programming and see how they can connect them to services to prevent out of home placement. So like there are community partners doing this work and we're often not in those conversations and you know I feel like that's how gas
29:16happen.
29:17Yeah. I mean we're very open to obviously reaching out and having those partnerships in lie of punitive measures for us youth in crisis specifically. So, if we respond to a call, um it might be better suited for that family or that youth for us to make a phone call to someone else to say, "Hey, can someone respond here?" And then we can leave. Um not because we don't want to deal with it, but because there are probably better people suited to handle that. And I've seen interactions with HPD where they've been extremely accommodating.
29:52young person is in crisis, but their hands are literally tied because they might not rise to the level of needing to go to the emergency room. Parents are at this end, but there's no other resources to suggest to them. So then it's a overall awkward interaction because they're like, "Well, seems like everything's safe. You're just still upset and we have to go." So, you know, those are the moments that it would be good to have something to offer to families even if it's somebody to talk to.
30:24What is the cartil program?
30:27Um, again, I just found out about it, but it it is a service offered to students who need like mental health services. They offer like tea health, I think, appointments. Um, and they can have access at any point. Um, and the district has like a contract with this program for a certain number of spots. They get counselors, they get therapists, families can opt into it. Um, it's free for students. The referrals come from the guidance department. Could be kids at risk. Could be kids that are just in need of getting student services.
31:01I think the district only has like a certain number of spots contracted. So once they meet that, right, there's
31:07Yeah,
31:08it's kind of a tough
31:09thing, right?
31:11Okay. Thank you. Um well, I guess it's uh back to you,
31:18man. I think I've gone over my time already. Um
31:22so I'll restart the clock.
31:24Uh no body warn cam reports indicating any training needs. Uh for July, there were two defensive action reports. Um those are also our use of force reports. One um a subject was taken to the ground after resisting and um charged for escaped. They slip a cuff swollen the back of the back of the police car tried to run um and subsequently placed on the ground and back in handcuffs back in the car. Um that same individual was arrested again. A taser was pointed at that person um and then
32:09subsequently charged and arrested uh both times charged with a DWI refusal and hit the same police car both times resulting in damage and one of the police cars being out of service. Roughly 12k worth of damage. There's two separate incidents. So, uh I guess we have to pay two different deductibles for that.
32:37No, not if it was that person.
32:39No. Insurance adjuster said there was two different incidents. So, we'll have to pay two different
32:47shouldn't have to pay any deductible because they're at fault unless they're two different. So,
32:53it was like two week time span. So, it was one incident. Yeah. completely different
32:58and then same person, same police car.
33:02Oh
33:03yeah,
33:03they have insurance. Their insurance isn't covered now.
33:07I mean, I think
33:10either way. Yeah,
33:12I think we'll have to pay it first.
33:15Yeah,
33:17right. We would have to pay it regardless.
33:21Yes.
33:23All right.
33:26Yes. 37 arrests and 66 charges, nine emotionally disturbed person calls, and one all involving suspected drug overage. And then one Narcan in Winchester on that same incident. Total number of incidents was 898 for July.
33:50Oh, that's a lot.
33:52It's a few.
33:53It's a busy month.
33:55Yes. Summer tends to be a little bit
33:57Yeah.
33:58uptick in things.
34:00Okay. Um any other items on your agenda?
34:05We have national night out tomorrow from 5 to 8.
34:09Come on through.
34:11Um there's a lot of stuff happening.
34:15Yeah. I saw it on social media.
34:17That's at Oakdale or HPD.
34:18It is at Waterfront.
34:20Waterfront. I meant it's at the waterfront.
34:22It is at the waterfront. Yes.
34:24Right. again. Okay.
34:26Slope Club's going to be offering some boat rides. There's going to be uh there's going to be food. Uh Operation Street Night's doing a pollinator parade like they did a couple weeks ago at Waterfront Wednesday and Bendlestiff's Stilt Walkers are going to be in that. Um there's going to be ice cream bounce house tank.
34:49I don't know if I'm going to sit. That's usually for the younger officers. I did one year though there will be a dunk tank so you can dunk an officer. It's usually popular. We have toys. I think I mentioned that last meeting.
35:02Yes.
35:02Um so it should be a good time.
35:05And weather looks like it's going to hold out.
35:07Weather looks like it's going to be really good for tomorrow. So hey, glad.
35:10And code enforcement can definitely be in the time.
35:14Yes, absolutely.
35:15He's got inspected.
35:18Sorry. Yeah. Uh, and also I think Mr. Krueger is probably going to touch on traffic up on Upper Warren. We did receive our speed recording device, our smaller one that you can't. It looks like a trail cam and it is on Upper Warren currently was put up today.
35:39Nice.
35:40I wasn't going to say anything.
35:41No,
35:41I didn't have any questions on
35:44it was put up today. It was put up today.
35:47Thank you.
35:47You're welcome. Well, that takes care of the traffic cam update as well.
35:52Yes,
35:55that's all I have.
35:56Awesome. Thanks. Um, Captain Miller, I saw your email with the traffic reports. Um, I didn't print it. Sorry. Just quickly here, I'll just go over the parking.
36:09Sorry, that's what I meant. The parking reports.
36:11Yeah, my apologies. For July, uh we issued 2,817 parking tickets during the month, which 2,475 were paid, uh generating a little bit over 62,000 in revenue for July alone. Also, for quarter 1 and two for parking,
36:35for revenue, uh we're at $812,400. So, we're doing all right with that. And for traffic for quarter 1 and two, uh, we wrote almost 600 traffic uh, tickets throughout the city. That's all I have to report. Thank you. I noticed that the cash revenue is is virtually low in terms of the revenue coming in and in terms of the cash, right? It was only $100, right?
37:06Correct. Correct. Are we seeing an increase uh or decrease for the virtual parking payments versus when we had the coin?
37:19Yeah. I mean, people because of technology, you know, where we're at, they seem to prefer to use the electronic way.
37:2745 grand or something, I think. Right.
37:29Yeah. The majority of it is it's that um for example uh it took us eight months to empty out the quarters out of the um kiosk that we had because not too many people use it as an option.
37:44So they prefer the use it way because it's just it's just easier to do
37:50for most and if you do it all your license will save it. So yeah.
37:56Yeah, it's that one kind which takes a little it just so generates your information. It's already there and saves.
38:04Is that something we need to discuss later or
38:08No, I I uh have a permit.
38:14Cuz I have my tradesman's permit.
38:18Oh yeah. Oh,
38:20I see.
38:21I am perfectly within the loophole.
38:25That yearong loophole.
38:27Yeah,
38:27the Yeah.
38:28Oh, we had 12. I don't know. Just like
38:31we got to revamp that.
38:32Yes,
38:34we had 12 vehicles booted for July and 17 for June. I know sometimes people like to know.
38:43Yeah, I just like seeing the booths.
38:46I don't know why. Sorry.
38:51That resolution didn't pass right for or that wasn't discussed yet the council meeting for the the new fee schedule.
38:58No, no, we have to talk about
39:00Oh, actually, yeah,
39:01that was discussed at the finance meeting, but then supposed to be
39:05Yeah, we're supposed to talk about that actually at this meeting.
39:07Oh,
39:08do you want to talk about that
39:09when you want to just get send your recommendations?
39:12Yeah,
39:13do that to Margaret.
39:16Yeah.
39:16Um, you probably Uh, sorry. Can I speak on this?
39:24Can you can you hear me?
39:26Yes.
39:27Hi, Margaret.
39:28Okay. Hi. So, um, at we did bring the fee schedule uh which I had uh Rich and I worked on with uh and finance department committee worked on with you and Captain Miller. Uh we sent we brought that to the full council um to review um in addition to other fee schedule changes. Um we did get a couple of uh comments and recommendations. One of which was to increase I believe it was the uh fire zone parking to 125. There was also a recommendation for crosswalk
40:05to be increased to 50. So I will be making those amendments. Uh I asked council members to send me any comments that they had in writing. Uh but there are other fee schedule elements as well. We also brought all of the um code enforcement ones to the commit to the council. So I am putting them all together for a vote in uh August. A couple of them will require some code changes. So, one of the things that we have to actually change um is uh updating the code because the fines are
40:39actually in the code. So, that has to be updated. So, we're going to need a local law to update the code um because it has to be actually specified. It's not the fines are not a fee schedule uh in per se. They're they're a different animal and they have to be listed. So, I'm updating the code to reflect that. Um, and we should have the whole package together for the August meeting for a vote.
41:06Thank you.
41:06Thank you, Margaret. I know I sent an email followup to that. If I can if I can ask here, we can talk offline about it also. Um, since we have to change the code for these, can we also change the code for the municipal permits?
41:24That's being moved.
41:25Yes.
41:25Yeah. I don't know if it has to be a separate local.
41:29We have we have a slight we have a slight problem with that in that we're trying to do an administrative change here to move permitting over to the bureau in the police department. However, our beloved charter uh explicitly defines the parking a parking uh violation bureau whose duties are limited to collecting fines. So, we have to update uh the I believe it's in the charter. We have to update that to establish this broader parking thing that now resides at HPD so that we can move the permits
42:13over to that bureau. But certainly one of the questions that came up in the in the council meeting or in one of the meetings might have been in finance but uh should we be also increasing the permit fees? So yes, that is a question.
42:30Okay. So, we're going to keep uh parking violations bureau.
42:35Uh no, no. What what I I hope to have this at the next council meeting. Um I want to update it to define the parking bureau and to remove the restriction on the responsibilities of the parking bureau because currently it is restricted to collecting fines. I just meant like we could have we could keep it the violations bureau and add
43:03add to the description of what they're legally allowed to do. I didn't know if that was easier if you if you or if the council would prefer it to just be the parking bureau. The reason the reason I'm asking is we want our policy to reflect what is
43:18well currently uh there is a discrepancy between the charter and the parking bureau that was established by the last administration.
43:29So that has to be resolved. Um let me let me uh follow up with you um and see what we need to do. I would rather not have a parking bureau and a parking violations bureau. I'd rather have a parking bureau that has broader responsibilities.
43:45Okay.
43:46Sounds good to me. Thank you,
43:48Margaret. I had also um emailed you about some of the the schedules for code enforcement um that
43:56Greg had uh
43:58Yep. I I differ with some of them.
44:02I I brought all of those to the full council. your recommendations which ones you said to leave as is to leave the permit. So I uh brought your email to the full council with feedback for the council on these are the changes that have been recommended by code enforcement. So those will all be reflected in what we bring to the meeting uh in August.
44:24Okay. Thank you. the the only one where there was push back on was on the uh 300 for the permitting for the uh non Columbia County permit plumber
44:37the plumbing one uh that's the only one where there was push back um so you and I can talk about that but um yeah we can we can discuss that but that's the only one where there was push back.
44:48Yeah. Okay. Um, well, my suggestion on that one, if you want to talk about it now, was that uh Columbia County plumbers pay one fee and outside of Columbia County would be paying another fee.
45:03Oh, yes. She she actually did bring that up.
45:05Okay.
45:05To clear it up.
45:06No, we because Well, there's a lot of confusion also, uh, Nick, about um when that fee applies and it only applies when you need a plumbing permit. And a lot of a lot of things do not you may a lot of things that plumbers do do not need a plumbing permit unless you're actually putting in pipes or doing plumbing.
45:29And so I think there is a misconception that if you have somebody coming out fixing a leak uh that you're going to be hit like a $200 job is going to cost you $500 because of this. And I I think we from the plumbers just trying to get some extra money out of it because they're not even going to pull a permit for it. But they're going to
45:51get the plumber.
45:54Uh when did they when we said like it's from us
45:58they we don't want to work, you know, because they say it's
46:04they might not be aware that they not need a permit
46:09and there might be someone trying to goosey a little bit. A lot of plumbers too, they just have a service fee of a few hundred just to get in their truck, you know. Yeah. So,
46:21yeah, Nick, I'll I will follow up with you to make sure that we have it buttoned down before the meeting, but I did bring your email and comments to the full meeting.
46:30Okay. Thank you.
46:33Thank you, Margaret. Um, so the parking violation fees that we discussed briefly were the fire zone. Um, I think Dominic that and the handicap zone. Um, Dominic thought that the fire zone should be
46:56125.
46:57I said 150, but whatever. Yeah. More than I mean, it's a fire zone. You should It shouldn't be just get towed. Why even ticket them?
47:08So yeah. Um if we could make that one higher,
47:11that's totally up to you. If you have any objections to that, we just enforce whatever you guys you know is fine.
47:19The more we deter it, the better.
47:22Yeah.
47:22Um
47:24the the other one, sorry, the other one, uh Henry, is uh crosswalk.
47:29Uh Jason wanted to see that one increased to 50. Oh yeah, that's only 35. That I'd say more more like that one should be just as egregious as the fire zone and impeding public safety.
47:43So I would put that one all the way up, too.
47:46Yeah, I agree with that.
47:47100 or 125. What are you doing?
47:50So So here's here's what I'm going to say. At the meeting, I asked council members to send me their comments via email on anything. So, uh, I have everything in writing and, um, part of what we have to balance here is, uh, putting fines in, um, that are not, you know, an outrageous shock on the one hand, but also, and we did prioritize safety, but also being relatively consistent with what other municipalities are doing. And so that was something that that was something that the finance committee and the police department and Rich actually went and looked at fines and other municipalities. That's something that we tried to balance in doing this.
48:37Okay. Uh so we'll I'll send you an email after we finish our meeting.
48:44Yeah. And and that message goes to all of the council members. Anyone and Jason has already sent me his. So anyone I'll send a reminder that if you have any comments on any of the piece schedules that you need to send me an email.
48:56Okay.
48:59Thank you very much.
49:00Was there any questions uh about the collections piece? I know uh the collections contract got approved a couple of months ago. Was there any questions from the council for the committee about that?
49:12No.
49:12Are you are you talking are you talking about the process where after a certain point it goes into debt collection?
49:18No. No. No, not that part because that that's not going to go into effect until obviously this all gets passed and and filed with the Secretary of State. But um
49:30no, what we're going to do is give the uh okay
49:34to the vendor to start collection services on all the previous tickets.
49:40Oh, yes. No, we didn't. That was not discussed. That that was not discussed, but I think you need to move forward with that.
49:46Okay. Yeah, that's the that is that is the plan. Um, we'll probably be sending out uh final notices to folks first uh and then giving them a 30-day window to pay to remedy first.
50:02Okay.
50:03When you say past like years,
50:05like uh the previous three years. Okay. Gotcha.
50:08So, legally we can only go back three years. Yeah. So that will be I believe it was January 23 or something some somewhere around it.
50:18Dominic, this is this is the file of outstanding fees that uh Captain Miller had sent to us a while back. uh some of them go back years and um many of them are people who have repeated tickets so it's not like they don't live here but the previous process uh I guess mainly for staffing reasons was that you would get a reminder at the 30-day window and then you would never get another reminder. So once a month reminders went out to anybody who was at 31 days but
50:50that was the only reminder that you got. So people would simply, you know, if they hadn't paid in within the third within the 30 to 60 day, they didn't hear about it again and they probably forgot about it.
51:02Yeah. And then after three years, they they heard about it.
51:05Yeah. Yeah.
51:07And and this was this was the database where a couple of years ago, previous administration did the amnesty and uh like I don't remember it was hundreds of thousands of dollars in this file. Uh, literally three people came forward for the amnesty.
51:25So, this is what this is.
51:28Okay. Well, thank you. I don't want to think about that.
51:34Wish I had never paid my parking tickets for years. I paid Edie $1,500 a month so I felt terrible.
51:41Wow.
51:42What? What?
51:43Then you learn loophole.
51:44I learn. No, I was also like 23.
51:47Oh, well, don't worry about it. running on all six cylinders over here. So, we're going to have it all
51:53We used to have compounding interest on all the uh fines.
51:59Um and then it went away like 10 or 15 years ago maybe and
52:03but fine but not as compounding which is fine.
52:10Then this was a more simple formula for everybody.
52:13Yeah. I mean everything comes in uh circles. So here we are again. Um, okay. Going down the list. Anything else?
52:22Not for me.
52:23Okay. Let me breeze right through one of the things I was going to bring up with the with the fee changes. So, I'm just going to shoot Margaret an email from the one we discussed here. And that's the only change I have. Um, I think I think I don't have anything else for HPD. All right. Excellent. Um, questions in the room. Question. Um Brent with on Warren Street as relates to and this might be a completely separate topic as relates to bliss powers of the deconstruction and construction. Is there any word or are there numbers out
53:01there that exist with regards to transportation trucks going back and forth?
53:08Not on our end. We don't have that information. I think it's a little
53:11Yeah, that would go through the planning, I think, right? And there's
53:16Well, it will, but this is the safety community.
53:19Yeah.
53:20And
53:21they don't until largest projects ever
53:24until they approve anything. We're not going to hear anything.
53:28It's good to bring it up though. about the planning board and see if that's something that they uh are going to be
53:3521 trucks that I indiscriminately counted while I was working on my laptop street
53:43but not going down the street. So
53:45yeah,
53:46a lot of bonded concrete
53:48to that project
53:50back not there just generally speaking. So
53:53so trucks obviously bliss
53:59are related to
54:02that's already current trucks back and forth. And so let's add him completely.
54:08Yeah.
54:09Another chapter chapter
54:11any any development down there. Well, so will the potential
54:17uh 150 unit.
54:21There might be a to be some consideration though to have trucks for Bliss using Third Street instead of coming through upward.
54:29I'm sure they could ask Colossus to use their causeway as well.
54:32Yeah, that as well. When does sorry
54:36when does what
54:37it's still at the planning
54:38when when do we find that out
54:40it's still going through zoning and planning at this point
54:43I think when do we
54:44I think public comment is still open
54:46oh yeah I have comment
54:48okay
54:49um I don't know that is a good question actually
54:52Margaret to discuss
54:55job
54:57they do have to present what their
55:00their plan
55:00plan for deconstruction is and that would be part of it because those are questions that were asked early on in the presentation, but I don't think that they're at that point where they can say what the truck traffic would be or what the disposal pro process would be. I think that's something that they're actively working on, but need to get through like the first wave of planning board approval before they can work on the deconstruction plans.
55:25Yeah. Cuz two phases.
55:27Yeah.
55:27Well, the construction plans, I imagine they're going to have to bring a lot of fill down there to the other side as well.
55:32Okay. Yes. Well, uh, we will hopefully hear something by the next council meeting. U Margaret, if you can hear any of this, please chime in.
55:43If you've heard anything, um, you might actually get a maybe Joe has been in communication with them. Um, you definitely
55:51Nobody has Sorry. It's a little difficult. It's a little difficult to hear people from the public who are sitting in the back of the room rather than coming forward to be near the mic.
56:02Right. And also when when there's pe when people are more than one person is talking, it gets jumbled on the mic.
56:10So I didn't catch all of this conversation. The general question is, do we have any idea of the potential truck traffic that might be associated with the Bliss Towers uh reconstruction project or is it still too preliminary of a stage to get an answer?
56:33So, I do not have any information on that. I did hear somebody say that this would be planning board which I think is correct and I don't think that this is probably within the purview of the common council.
56:47Seriously, thank you.
56:49Could the Margaret could the could the council ask the planning board to encourage the contractors to to use a specific route through the city
57:01or no?
57:02They only have to adhere to the truck,
57:05right? I think the only thing they can do is that the planning board could do that. Right.
57:10And I'm not saying force them. I'm just say suggest hey if you can go third street but I'm saying that part of the resolution or or say in terms of from public comments and see whatever right they can say during this you have to minimize traffic here you must use this route right so I think that could be put in as part of the you know planning board uh agreement. I think that that's
57:35so we could actually just send a recommendation from the safety committee as a communication from the common council to the planning board to be
57:42well saying is AB and C that do you uh you want to put something together and we'll we'll send him a little recommendation letter and see if Margaret
57:52can we do that if the planning process
57:55absolutely
57:56we have letterhead we can do anything
58:01I I I I do think we need to be cautious here in that the planning board is an independent entity.
58:09It would be appreciated.
58:10We can still
58:11we can we can we can certainly express opinions.
58:16Yeah, that's all that just an opinion.
58:19Did you get a chance to look at the FAQs on HH asked that question? I'm just wondering if it's answered on there.
58:26I have no
58:28it might be answered on there about intervention.
58:31There are no studies there. There's just no information whatsoever given the breadth of the project. And I'm not talking and I'm not commenting and in my my letter on Friday did not comment at all on on list the structures themselves. It's simply safety, pedestrian safety and trucks. And where are those trucks going? How are they leaving? When are we gonna find out
59:03what are the realities,
59:04right? Again,
59:06a lot of these sound like colusa questions.
59:09I mean, you know, these are easy ones for us. We've had these before. We should be able to nail this down.
59:15We're We'll figure it out.
59:16No, no, no. I appreciate lots. Thank you very much.
59:20Um, since we're on, uh, I did learn and I want to share it because I was did not know that there are 48 to 100 less trucks going through town because Colorado is using the causeway in the last two years. I have no idea.
59:41Um, our streets are so much quieter. Uh, what else do we have? Anything else from any council members? Shall we go to Nick Roadmaster? Code
59:54master. That's right. Um, okay. Nick, take it away. Um my monthly report we had 24 building permits, eight certificates of occupancy, uh three demo permits, one sign permit, one referral to HPC, which is a slow month for that, um one plumbing permit, and four letters of compliance, um for a monetary total of $14,46563. 3 cents.
1:00:30Slow month.
1:00:32It is. Um, last month when we were here, we talked about a few things. Um, one was the signs on the utility polls. Um, I contacted Verizon um to try to get them to write us a letter on one of their letterheads saying that we have the authority to remove these as soon as they're put up. Um, since it's their property, um, they advised us that they are actually co-owned between Verizon and National Grid. Um, so I need to get a letterhead from both of those companies to be able to do that. Um,
1:01:10otherwise, yeah.
1:01:12Yeah. Um otherwise plan B on that um if I can't achieve this is I can send them a letter a violation and then the building inspector has the authority to remove them 10 14 days later something like that. So worst case scenario uh that's what we'll have to do
1:01:34per sign.
1:01:35What's that
1:01:35as per sign violation per sign? Uh, good question.
1:01:44Would the violation be unmapped?
1:01:46Yeah, but I'd have to send it to Verizon and National Grid and wait to see if they respond, which they won't, of course. It'll just end up in a shredder somewhere, I'm sure. But if they just write us something on a letterhead saying, "Yes, you see a sign up there, take it down. We're cool with it." Then I'm cool with it. We can do that. Um
1:02:06are you saying I'm just Are you saying give us permission otherwise this is the consequence we don't have permission otherwise you are going to be responsible. Well, no. My first course of action is getting a written letter from them saying, "Yes, these all of the pools in the city are combined property between Verizon and National Grid." And um when you see a
1:02:31temporary sign go up on one of these poles, you have the city has the ability to take them down until further notice,
1:02:38you know. Um, and then as soon as we see him, Henry can go around and rip them down.
1:02:45Thank you.
1:02:46Um, the other signs that we talked about, uh, or are those portable signs, the sandwich signs that are
1:02:57those A-frame signs that are on the sidewalk
1:03:00that are all on the sidewalk. Um, digging into the code books some more on that. Um, I realize and confirmed with Andy Howard that these signs are only allowed in front of the businesses that they are advertising for.
1:03:17Correct.
1:03:18Yes.
1:03:19So, these companies or businesses are putting them all over the city, which clearly isn't in front of their place of business. Um, so I'm gonna take a ride around town and take some notes and give out some notices that they have to pick them up or they're going to be removed. Also,
1:03:37what's the pivot for businesses that are like right off of Orange Street? They wanted to have wayfinders for their business. Nick, I thought that there was um language that said they had to be within a certain number of feet of the business,
1:03:56right? Uh no, it it has to be in front of their business. And if their if their business is long enough they're allowed to have two signs.
1:04:07Got it.
1:04:08In front of that business within a 100 ft of each other,
1:04:12not
1:04:14business selling a like object. And they can't be scattered, right? Because there has to be a certain distance between them. So they can't scatter. They have to be have that straight path on the sidewalk, right? So they can't have one here in front of this corner of the business and over here, right?
1:04:30If it's in front of their business, uh say they have a big long building on Warren Street, if they can have two of them in front of that business within 100 ft of each other.
1:04:42Okay. No distance like 36 in. no distance in terms of a clear pathway because
1:04:47on the sidewalk I'm sorry.
1:04:48Yes, they still have to uh uh
1:04:51is it an issue?
1:04:54Like that's a general question. Is it is there some concerns about the like the boards?
1:05:00Yeah. When we when someone trips and sues us probably I I think it's also up to the building owner.
1:05:08Yeah. Well, I'm just I'm just
1:05:10There are a lot of people that advertise some signs from down the street end up in front of businesses on a block.
1:05:17There's also uh for example, Upper Depot has them all over the place and the signs are peeling and you can't even tell what it is anymore or anything like that. So, like just go get them, you know, pick them up. I didn't know if there if uh the council wanted considered like a permit for folks to have one out like
1:05:36to be able to have
1:05:37to be able to place it somewhere but obviously it can't be
1:05:41for example you know that's between
1:05:46Yep. And and that's a good point because there is another there is one uh a new cafe deli on Columbia Street
1:05:55and they put their sign on the other side of the Seventh Street Park.
1:06:01Um
1:06:03and they said that's when they started getting business, you know, because they're kind of off in the cut. Nobody really knows where they are. So, you know, if the code as it's written now is how I explained it. Um, so if the council thinks there should be amendments to be able to uh make the codes more um lenient for those advertising purposes for those off of main street businesses then
1:06:31I think there should be a time frame otherwise it's going to be chaotic right I think there should be a limit a certain amount of time 30 days or whatever otherwise you're going to have
1:06:41good point yeah
1:06:42all all works right Yeah.
1:06:46Or you can you could set parameters that like it's only allowed to be there at these hours or like whenever the business is and you establish that like within their permit and then it has to be removed. So again that they're overnight supposed to be anyway. I'm pretty sure
1:07:01that doesn't happen.
1:07:02They are supposed to I think it does say that too.
1:07:06Yeah. Yeah. And they're not supposed to be a fixed
1:07:09which Yeah. Yeah, a lot of them are paying great to our polls and everything like that
1:07:13and not like the one on like Union Street Brewing. They're advertising on Warren
1:07:20because they're off of Warren. Makes perfect sense.
1:07:22So that should be
1:07:22but their sign is advertised within a distance of the same type of a business that is offering
1:07:30the same product and that is against the code.
1:07:32So that's also the proximity of where they're allowed to put their signs on the street. I'm and I'm thinking of businesses like circles. You don't see circles unless they put their a brand.
1:07:43But if they put their bagel sign kitty corner nolitas, it's within 100 ft and now they're selling the same, you know.
1:07:50Yeah.
1:07:51So that like
1:07:53should be reviewed further.
1:07:55And I would like the chamber of commerce for suggestions too like what the businesses have to say.
1:08:01I think this is this one doesn't need to even be that hard. Um, maybe we'll just all read the little section and shoot some ideas and be done with it. Again, chamber person recommendations. Gary works there.
1:08:15A ton of businesses in Maryland.
1:08:18Yeah, they should.
1:08:20They should have no sandwich for us because they're tripping hazards, but that's
1:08:24Well, they're still supposed to respect the
1:08:27foot of Yeah.
1:08:29Well, that that one is a toughy. Well, honestly, the way it's written, it it doesn't
1:08:35doesn't say.
1:08:36Uh, it it it almost makes it so they can't be on the sidewalk at all,
1:08:43right?
1:08:44Uh, which is what, you know, anyho,
1:08:49how about an electronic city guide like they have at the malls?
1:08:53Electronic city guide. Yeah.
1:08:54Yeah. We should put kiosks next to our
1:08:57one of those planes that flies over with the banners. Yeah,
1:09:02I just thought it was a good idea. That's all.
1:09:03Remember the police department had the ban,
1:09:07you know, like the the mall signs where you can find all of your your stores based on like
1:09:13the map and then somebody can go to the directory, the city like business directory and then and then see it.
1:09:24Great ideas. Guess I should get into advertising. That's what you should do. Um, anything else, Nick?
1:09:31Maybe we can discuss it with um Bobs,
1:09:36the collapsed building uh that we had over on Columbia Street.
1:09:41Um, this building was one of the buildings that I had pegged to put on the vacant building registry.
1:09:49Oh. Um, but I was holding on that uh with some communications that I had with you guys regarding um some of the changes that I thought should be considered um
1:10:04thank you
1:10:05to the code. Um
1:10:08so 225
1:10:10225 and a half 225.5. So, that's a good segue into um some of the code changes that I've been looking at and some codes that I've been looking at and think might need some changes and amendments. Um so, upon reviewing chapter 97, demolitions of buildings, um I identified several pro provisions that I believe would benefit from a revision to better reflect current construction practices, clarify responsibilities, and further protect the public. Wait, sorry. I wanted to start with vacant buildings, right? That's this one.
1:10:48Thanks.
1:10:50You can take this one, too. I got
1:10:52Okay.
1:10:54Okay. Vacant buildings. While preparing to begin enforcement of chapter 91, vacant buildings, I conducted a thorough review of the city's vacant building regulations. During that review, I noted that the first available compliance option for removing a property from the vacant building registry is demolition of the structure. While demolition is in some cases an appropriate means of protecting public safety, I believe it should generally be considered as a last resort after reasonable opportunities for rehabilitation have been evaluated or determined to be impractical. The purpose of the vacant building laws should not only be to eliminate unsafe structures, but also to encourage the
1:11:33rehabilitation, preservation, and productive reuse of buildings whenever feasible. Demolition certainly has its place, particularly where a structure poses an imminent hazard or is beyond repair. However, when rehabilitation remains a viable option, preserving existing buildings oft historic preservation, housing availability, and the long-term tax base of the city. So, I have prepared a proposed amendment to for the common council's consideration. is intended to serve as a template and may be revised or refines refined as the council, city attorney or other appropriate parties deemed necessary throughout the process.
1:12:15Um the proposed amendment um is chapter 91 section 3 um the vacant building registry. Um what I did was so the code was written so that demoing the building was the first option um which clearly shouldn't be um with all things considered. So I moved the recommendations around um putting rehabilitating the building as the number one option. Number two option was and still would be securing the building. If they don't if they don't have the means or whatever to rehabilitate the building at the time, then secure it, board it up, make it safe, um stabilize it if necessary. Uh
1:13:10number three, uh is what I moved to demolition of the vacant buildings. Um, if the building cannot be reasonably rehabilitated pursuant to subsection one and it is determined by the owner to be beyond practical repair or economically economically feasible rehabilitation, the owner does not and the owner does not elect to maintain the building as a vacant structure pursuant to subsection two. The owner may submit a demolition plan. The time frame for obtaining all required permits and postdemolition site restoration plan and demolition activities shall be performed in compliance with requirements of chapter 97 buildings demolition of and other
1:13:59applicable provisions of the city of Hudson and New York State code. Compliance under this subsection shall not be considered complete until all applicable requirements of chapter 97 including post demolition site restoration have been satisfied questions. I also included the vacant buildings chapter for you.
1:14:25Thank you. These are going to be great. Um we're going to send it right to um what's his name? can
1:14:35so if I could if I could just speak on the procedure here.
1:14:39So and and Nick and I had met and discussed this I guess about six weeks ago. So Nick has made some proposals here for changes to the code. So I think that this this committee should work on revised code language and uh a uh how how they want that to go. You can send it to the legal committee. Ideally, if you could put together a draft local law or you can just send the code changes that you're recommending to the legal committee and then we can put a local law together to make the change and take it to the full council for a vote.
1:15:14Yeah. Do you want do we need to go to legal or can we just work with Ken?
1:15:18Well, if you if you send it to legal, we will work we will create a local law. If you do the code changes,
1:15:25send it to legal. legal, put together a local law and send it to the council.
1:15:28Sure.
1:15:29Just want to give you as little to do as we can.
1:15:32Well, that would that would do as that that would give me as little to do as possible.
1:15:37You got it.
1:15:39I also had two key chapter 97 and chapter 93. Would you like me to read them also or like me to give them to Henry?
1:15:49That's okay. What I'm saying, Henry, is the part that is work is what Nick has just been working on, which is actually coming up with the recommended code changes. And the e the easy part is putting together a local law uh that says we are recommending these changes.
1:16:09Yeah. No, I got you.
1:16:11Thank you. This is perfect.
1:16:17We do have three. Would you like me to read the other two?
1:16:21Just give us the synopsis of both of them.
1:16:23Um, the second one is the demolition of buildings. Um, there were provisions in there that would better reflect current construction practices. Um first of all the first problem was that um 97-3F had the responsibility of the neighboring property to protect their property on the owner of the neighboring property.
1:16:54What?
1:16:54Right. Your neighbor knocks down their building. It's your job to protect yours.
1:16:58That doesn't make sense.
1:16:59That doesn't make any sense. That's my first proposed amendment that's written out in here also.
1:17:04Um,
1:17:04that was in the that was in the subsection of the demolition.
1:17:09Okay.
1:17:10Is demolition chapter 9797-3F. Actually, I changed it to I'm not going to read it. You can read it.
1:17:18Thank you.
1:17:19You're welcome. Yeah.
1:17:20Um and then an addition to chapter 97 would be 97-3 K. Um the second problem in chapter 97 was that there's nothing about what we expect a lot to look like when it's done
1:17:44being demoed. that we can have a pit in the ground with a fence around it and it can just be left like that. So, I wrote up a provision in here to make sure that the property is properly graded
1:17:59um easily maintainable and they should have a maintenance plan going forward. If it's going to be grass growing in there, then they clearly need to mow it and it just can't become an unsightly lot pit. stand up and encourage women
1:18:16like like any of Galvan's pit lots,
1:18:20right? Uh speaking of which, Galvin uh has been grabbing some demo permits, which is why I think this is another one that should be
1:18:29Yeah, let's expedite this along quickly.
1:18:32Questions on that one?
1:18:35No, for me. Um the third one was a an add-on to chapter 93 regarding building permits. Um the synopsis is that Hudson is growing. Um the projects are getting larger. Um we have a understaffed and underfunded code enforcement department. um for the larger and more complex projects that are on the horizon such as Hudson Housing Authority um and the Waterfront Village. Um, I'm proposing that the applicant or developer pay for a independent third party um, plan with you. Um they would have to be uh a certified
1:19:40code enforcement officer also meeting certain credentials and uh the projects that would qualify for this are also in the amendments that I put in there. Um, they're more complex projects, ones that are commercial, mixeduse, industrial, institutional, or multif family developments exceeding $5 million in estimated construction value. Buildings exceeding three stories in height or 20 square ft in gross floor area. Projects containing engineered fire protection systems, smoke control systems, specialized structural systems, or other complex life safety features. High hazard occupancies or projects involving un unusually complex occupancy
1:20:35classifications or mixed occupancies. Projects utilizing alternative materials, alternative methods of construction, or performance-based code designs requiring specialized review. Or any project due to its size, complexity, scope, or technical requirements is determined by the code enforcement officer to warrant additional independent review or inspections in the interest of public safety and code compliance. This isn't something new. This is something that other cities are doing that have these more complex buildings or projects going on. I think it's something that we should consider adding to our codes to better help my
1:21:20department, the city, the safety of the occupants that are going to be visiting or living in these buildings.
1:21:28Sounds like a pretty reasonable request. um might have helped to the pocketbook factory. It was Frank's biggest project
1:21:38uh in there also as one of the projects that may have met those along with Upper Depot
1:21:45and uh the Kites Nest one that's in the early stages now
1:21:49but would already be grandfathered into these clauses.
1:21:54Uh thank you. But just so you know, the Hudson Housing Authority has actually volunteered to get a um third party review.
1:22:03So, so planning board doesn't have the independent engineer that does this.
1:22:08They have an engineer. Um they do review them. Um I'm not sure of their credentials, but the planning board mostly looks at site plan and not actual
1:22:22construction of the building itself.
1:22:25Yeah, they're kind of done once it's approved.
1:22:29Um any other questions from the council members?
1:22:33Margaret, I see you have a question. We are ready for you.
1:22:36Okay, so couple of observations here. Uh Nick, thank you for looking at that. Um can you provide the council with examples of other municipalities that do this? That would be the first thing, right? And the second thing is that um you know to Dominic's point, the the engineer at the planning board does not doesn't do uh building evaluation. Um it is very much about the site and so forth. It's not like evaluating the building after construction. Um however the building permits the pricing of building permits is um based on the
1:23:18value of the project. Correct.
1:23:21Correct.
1:23:22Right. So perhaps a way to do this to ensure that whoever the building uh inspector is that's doing this is truly independent would be to ensure that the permit fees that have to be paid. Maybe maybe modifying the way that's structured to include buildings of this kind so that your department could actually directly hire a third party uh building inspector that's accountable to your department. So that's truly independent because what I the thing that I would foresee with this is having a developer hire a uh building inspector
1:24:01for their own building.
1:24:03Right? So whereas if we were to make sure that the fees that we are charging are sufficient and that you work out some subcontracting arrangements with uh building inspectors uh so those fees are sufficient to pay the costs of you actually using a third party building inspector or fire inspector. So I think this is something that absolutely should go to the legal committee for review and for review by Kenda,
1:24:26but if you could get us examples of other municipalities, I think that would be great.
1:24:31Thank you, Margaret. I'll uh get other lists of other mun municipalities that are doing that. And I do have written in these provisions uh that the contractor or applicant will um open an escro account with the city treasurer to cover all fees and costs. the um consultants will be picked by the code enforcement officer.
1:24:52Excellent.
1:24:52Um that they will need to meet the credentials set forth in chapter 1204 of the state law and um
1:25:05so it sounds like a lot of what I'm raising you've already addressed
1:25:09should be covered but if legal has um other that they'd like to put in it I'd love to hear it. Okay, sounds good. Thank you.
1:25:18Thank you.
1:25:20And thank you. Um, anything else for code? Any more from code?
1:25:27I think I said it enough. I do have I don't know if we talked about this. I know I spoke a little bit in legal. So, one of my concerns is with the sidewalk law, right, is how it's written that is that um there's no enforcement, right, because of the way the law is written. So, we don't know how long it's going to take for this sidewalk to do what it needs to do. My concern is that emergency repairs should be an addendum somehow um to the current law that code deems a
1:26:07sidewalk to be unsafe
1:26:08to be unsafe now, right? We can't wait 3 years to be on the district for repair because if it gets fixed now, it's they're going to get credit anyway. But there's so many sidewalks out there now that probably aren't on target
1:26:24for the district for years. Right. Right. So if there's a way you can figure out how to do an amendment to address that, right? So we can bring it to legal say, you know, because that's that's a big thing right now.
1:26:38It is. I Yeah, I agree. Um and I'll look into it and I'll also see if it's my responsibility or DPW's responsibility um to I I think it comes to from I think it comes to your responsibility
1:26:57as an enforcement uh mechanis and then when it gets to a certain point it goes to DPW to do the repair and send the bill or whatever. Right.
1:27:09Right. If we can't get them to do the repair themselves then DPW might have to do the repair bill.
1:27:15Yeah. Right. Because because I know we I had to
1:27:17Well, would they send them a bill in this instance?
1:27:20Well, they would do the repair or send another bill, right? Or or it would be on their tax.
1:27:25Well, because I I asked because if now people are doing their sidewalks, they're getting a a credit.
1:27:30So, if DPW doesn't repair, then technically they're
1:27:35Well, well, they repair, right? That
1:27:38Well, if they do repair, right, because of an emergency.
1:27:41Yeah. Right. Then someone's got to pay for that and it should be the property owner and then property owner pays for it then they can put forward the credit right
1:27:51property owner is already being charged a tax though for it.
1:27:56So how can you how can you how can the city build when they're already getting built?
1:28:01Well because their bill is longated right it's a fee and it's longated over 10 15 years right. So but this in terms becomes an issue of
1:28:12so they pay it up front and that tax gets removed from
1:28:16right they get a credit for those
1:28:21okay I'll look into it
1:28:23because like I said I just see
1:28:27yes
1:28:29it's confusing
1:28:30it's complex third party I think it's a gap we lost just like the vacancy right we put the vacancy so many gaps in there. I think this is a gap for
1:28:41because everybody's like, "Oh, got to wait till the city." Well, no.
1:28:44Yeah,
1:28:44you can fall now. And if they fall, the city put a wall in place. That's dangerous. Right now, the liability comes on,
1:28:50right?
1:28:51Because there's no enforcement to repair that until 5 years or when the funds are there to hit that zone, whatever that zone is. Right now, they're going to focus on the DOJ zone. So, who knows when they're going to focus on the rest of the city. We know that's going to take a little long time. I think you're talking to do the whole city.
1:29:10Thanks. Columbia will have to worry about it.
1:29:14Yeah. There you go.
1:29:16What' you say?
1:29:17You don't have to worry about it. When they're going to have
1:29:20You're going to have $66 million.
1:29:28Yeah.
1:29:29Should I send these proposals to everybody or are you going to take care of it?
1:29:33Uh oh. These please email to me and Margaret.
1:29:37Okay.
1:29:37Email all of us in because we all should know.
1:29:40And CC Margaret and Ken.
1:29:42And if you you just email me, I'll do them, too.
1:29:47Okay. Nothing about the chickens. Why are the chickens? I'm so waiting for the chicken.
1:29:51Awesome. Uh
1:29:53we got to kill all the chickens.
1:29:54You hungry?
1:29:57Um the chickens are um we did follow up on that. Um
1:30:04rats
1:30:04right. There is provisions in the code that states that they have to keep it keep it clean and sanitary in order to avoid any infestation of uh insects or rats, mice. Yeah.
1:30:19It is in there. Um, it's just hard to uh figure, it's hard to prove that someone is um has rats um based on hearsay.
1:30:34Um and also to get into their backyard to it's it's tough.
1:30:43Proof of rat.
1:30:44Yeah. Um
1:30:46find some rat eggs.
1:30:48Rat eggs. Mhm. Um, yeah. And if somebody tells you no, you can't go in their backyard, then you got to get a warrant.
1:30:56Mhm.
1:30:57I mean, what I'm talking about, not even him.
1:31:00Huh. Yeah, I know. There's actually only like what was it, four or five?
1:31:04Yeah.
1:31:05Um, permits. There's probably more um chicken coops than there's permits. I'm sure there's more chicken coops than there's permits for them. Um,
1:31:14yeah. Well, that's a really great subject. Mari, do you have anything you'd like to add?
1:31:23Yeah, I did. I had a question about this because I've I have had the uh pleasure of sitting through the planning board's review of people who wanted to have chicken coops and it was detailed to put it mildly. And so my question was of the ones where you're getting complaints, are these ones that had gone through the planning board process um or not? And if they didn't go through the planning board process, they should be removed. So, I mean, it should be possible to determine if there's a complaint about
1:31:55um uh an infestation whether or not this this particular coupe uh has been given a permit.
1:32:04Um yeah, no, you're you're right. uh like the one that I found um with a rooster last month. I then came to find out uh that they didn't even have a permit for chickens whatsoever rooster. So
1:32:17yeah. So I mean those are the ones that are more likely to have issues and problems because they're probably because they're definitely not abiding by the terms of that are set out by the planning board. So they should be immediately told to remove their their coups.
1:32:30Yep. Um Yep. Uh I'll work on it the best I can. Um, also I am short staffed right now. Um, so
1:32:38No, I understand. I understand.
1:32:42What do you mean?
1:32:44It's literally me.
1:32:46Kind of not. Uh, we're just going back in time. Uh, thank you, Margaret. Anything else for Nick? Great job.
1:32:56Thank you.
1:32:57Thank you.
1:32:57Any more from Nick? Okay, then I think this meeting has completed.
1:33:09All right.

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