Common Council, Informal Meeting

1. 0:09Yes, I think everything on your radar. I hear you. Okay. Yeah.
2. 0:20[clears throat]
3. 0:28Are we? Yeah.
4. 0:30Okay. Uh this is sorry for this live delay. Uh this is the uh informal meeting of the common council for September 21st starting at 6:20 I guess. Um so we can have a focal President Morris here. Council member Hadad here. Hagen here. Rooney here.
5. 0:54Sarah here.
6. 0:55Foster here.
7. 0:56Roberts Belton here. Oo here. Cousin here, here.
8. 1:06Um, the minutes from the A25 meeting have been placed on file. You can review those before our next meeting. Uh, department reports. Uh, we have not received reports from youth or senior. We have received reports from police and fire. Um, DPW did not have an infrastructure meeting last month. So, there is no report from DPW. Uh so basically we are awaiting uh youth and seniors. Um I think I saw him send it. Did he send it? Excuse me. Did he send it? I thought I saw him. I did not see it when we were due today. We did not see it.
9. 1:43Um so now we are going to have uh reports from our committees. Infrastructure did not occur. So you have nothing to report. Correct. Uh Rich, I don't know if you have anything from finance. I just can't ask you anything.
10. 1:58Okay. 73.
11. 2:01And the only uh thing I want to mention on finance is as you are aware um the departments have submitted their um their budget documents which I have circulated to everyone. The BEA meetings are beginning I believe the week of the 28th. Uh there will be no meetings on the week of October uh 5th. Um but otherwise those meetings occur in the afternoons uh Tuesdays and Fridays sometimes Mondays the schedule has at this point posted. Um we will attempt to make sure that they are also virtual so that people can listen in. Um but if you can make it to any of those you can look at the schedule and determine which ones uh are most important for you to attend. Uh but I encourage you to review the budget documents that we have received. They posted as the calendar or is that somewhere where they posted?
12. 2:59Uh it should have been I don't know if that's been posted online yet on the website but typically it gets posted on the website. So it didn't list the media meetings and what department is is scheduled. So I know that I believe all of the departments have responded. There had to be some changes. Heather puts out a suggested schedule for each department as to when they're going to meet and I believe she have to change one or two of them uh for availability but they typically get posted on the website and then we've seen them we've been sent will they um request documents be publicly I that is a question I have to ask Heather if they get posted publicly or not. Uh but the entire process is open to the public.
13. 3:44Will it be helpful? Documents were helpful.
14. 3:46I will ask Heather if they have them posted.
15. 3:51Excuse me, Heather. Okay, go ahead, Heather.
16. 3:58Yes, just a couple things. I'm in communication with Lyric. Uh they have not been posted on the website yet because I'm waiting for one department head to uh confirm uh his availability for a reschedule. So, I hope to have that done by tomorrow. And uh in terms of Jason's question, we can certainly put um all the budget requests up online. I will probably do that under the uh treasurers uh section of the website.
17. 4:26Thank you.
18. 4:28Okay. Uh so that's nothing else on finance. Um do you want to speak to uh uh services, Dominic?
19. 4:38Sure. Um we didn't have a forum so it was basically in informal. Uh we did meet Britney Gillis the new uh senior commissioner. Uh she seemed very energetic uh great ideas um you know for uh the uh seniors. Jen gave her some great information of what we've collected um right now. So um hopefully it's going to be a good term. I know she's concentrating right now on on the budget uh she said. So hopefully by you know next month we'll have some solid information on where it's going.
20. 5:11Uh same thing with the youth department. Youth department ended the camp uh at in on the 18th I believe it was of August the 14th of August and then um there's a boom as somebody knows he had he closed Oakdale because of the algae bloom. uh they're I think they're starting the transition into opening up the youth center uh for September 14th opening date uh as school opened up. So uh that's basically it. He said that the um I think staffing uh he's he's down I think he has said he has four five full-time staff and then he's going to be using part-time staff uh to fill in the gaps.
21. 6:03There is one resolution before us this evening, a budget uh amendment, not budget amendment, transfer. Um code enforcement did a uh fire inspection uh which they will be doing on an annual basis. Uh there were a number of items identified um and there is one of the resolutions be voting on next week is to move monies from one area to another to address uh the deficiencies that were noted.
22. 6:31they mostly related to um exercise on the level of the gym floor. There were a couple of things that were in staff only areas also uh but that were thought was uh should be available to you. And I think um moving forward on the agenda I'm going to add for seniors and youth for inspections and reports so we get a heads up on any issues uh ahead of time. Um I know there's uh a precamp inspection and midcamp inspection. So uh it would be nice that we get a report on that. Okay. You know during our uh each committee meeting.
23. 7:09Uh do we have any questions Logan online so far? Okay. Uh the legal committee uh we met and we reviewed three local laws which I will be laying on your desks later this evening. Um so we did not have any other business in that meeting. So, I will just hold that off until we get to the local laws. Um, that brings us to safety. Henry, um, thanks.
24. 7:31We had a quick safety meeting. Uh, it's almost an hour and, uh, fire is pretty standard. Um, the truck should be here soon. Am I right? Yeah. Uh, pretty much everything else is, uh, status quo. Um HP we lost an officer this month and hopefully we can fill the vacancy soon. Uh revenues up for parking um was like 28% over last year at this uh quarter I think. No for this month rather.
25. 8:04Um and we had a short discussion on the topic of plate readers and the relating to the because we've had those for 20 years now. um relating to the new system nationally that is kind of in a lot of the headlines, the flock system and uh that revolving around close to the um the stuff on our desk, the uh the bill from Senator Henchi for the state uh regulations and definitions and basically kind of what we already have in Hudson.
26. 8:43But [clears throat] uh we it's better to hear from the professional in the room and that is our chief. Um, and if the if chief you have anything to report or rather to update us on our where we are and how you feel about the system in the county versus what we have and how you you and council president see us moving forward to protect ourselves because we just to reiterate we have been doing this for 20 years in Hudson.
27. 9:18Um, I can speak briefly on it. Um, Lieutenant Firo, he's handled a lot of the acquisition of the camera systems and he knows a lot more about the ins and outs, but um, I we are administrators of that system, Axon, that we've had um, our department along with President Morris and mayor's office had a meeting last week of, you know, what we can do collectively to make sure that there's safeguards in place uh, for our current system and what we've been using.
28. 9:48Um, and we've had LPRs here in Hudson for over two decades now. Um, most of our internal policy mirrors Hinchi's bill to a certain extent, uh, aside for a couple of items. Um, and then we can, you know, we have a side discussion on what those things are. I don't want to really get into those right now unless the council or the public has any more questions um, about that.
29. 10:12But since this whole thing happened in the county, we put up our public transparency portal on the city website. Um Bowen wants to pull it up. That's up to him. So anyone can see, you know, how many plates are being read that like it doesn't give you any data, just numbers of what's being read, what's being hit. Um our hot list that we have on there is updated by New York State. We only enter in information from our bootable vehicles, from our parking system. So if there's any alert messages, that's internally input by us. Uh Hudson owns all of that data. Axon can't even access that data without first notifying us um and saying, "Hey, is it okay if we look into it or there's a problem?"
30. 11:00So I just want to refer back to the meeting that um Chief Franken mentioned. So, uh, Mayor Ferris, myself, and Chief Franklin met last week, uh, to evaluate this where we are in the situation, in the current situation, uh, looking at what the city is is utilizing, looking at current New York State law, and also, and I put on your desks a copy of the draft legislation that uh, uh, Senator Hinchi is is sponsoring.
31. 11:33And so as Chief Franklin indicated, if you look at the policies and procedures for Hudson Police Department, um they are very much in line with what is in this document. Uh and some of the things that we talked about were the fact that uh New York state law uh New York state has passed a law prohibiting uh cooperation between local law enforcement and federal agencies. Uh some counties are protesting that and suing the state. So that's a to be determined as to how that would play out.
32. 12:00Um but one of the things that we really wanted to look at and it's in HI's proposed legislation uh is not sharing any information. So, you know, obviously if there's a situation where there is a missing child or there is, you know, some person is at risk, um Hudson Police Department might cooperate with a neighboring uh entity to in that in that particular uh case, but the Henry legislation actually prohibits sharing of any information outside of the state.
33. 12:34And that was something that we discussed in our meeting that we are very much in agreement with that. And so I think we need to have more meetings, flesh this out, come out with a policy for the city um that balances protecting privacy, which is absolutely critical uh particularly privacy in terms of sharing any information outside of local law enforcement beyond what is necessary for protecting public safety.
34. 13:05So we want to protect privacy and also at the same time um continue to allow our community police forces to protect our safety. So that's the balance that we're trying to strike here. Yes, Jenny.
35. 13:18Um I don't know if you're aware, but I I said the entire council and the county um eight pages of research that I had done and within that research um I found that the ACLU says that axon cameras, the ones that we use, um they have a contract with VHS. So that was disturbing to me.
36. 13:42The other thing that I found that I thought was super disturbing is the number of times that [clears throat] the plates are read long. So there was a an independent study done in California where the the [clears throat] mounted cameras were reading plates around 30% of 37% of the time and the car and the ones that were mounted inside the car were were reading it 35% of the time wrong. So when your hot list are not or updated continuously, [clears throat] things go really haywire and and it's, you know, I don't think any of us distrust the police or distrust a sheriff. We But we do know you're human and we also I distrust third party interference. Like I if I knew that our loop was closed completely, I feel a little bit better about it. Although I just don't like surveillance of any.
37. 14:48So with with the contract with DHS, just Axon in general, I believe they have body cameras just like we do. So within a contract like that, that's most likely what they're talking about. does not share any data that is obtained by individual departments with other departments.
38. 15:10That's right on the public transparency portal. It says right on there that it's not shared with any federal agency. I trust you guys. I don't trust them.
39. 15:19Is the data stored on your servers?
40. 15:22It's it's on it is on the cloud. So for instance, I deal with all the technical [clears throat] stuff when it comes to Axon. If I have a phone call with them because we're having a problem and I start talking to them, they're like, "Okay, well, we need your permit your permission." They send me an email. I get a code that I have to provide to them for them to even access any of our system. They can't get into the data and by data plate number that we can all see with our own eyes to get it.
41. 15:56Not even. So even another agency with I'm going to use the sheriff's office they have access we have access I cannot they cannot run a plate in their system and get anything that is read in the city of Hudson on our system there is it is up to us as a department if that information is shared with anybody unlike where it's everybody there's it's just open Axon is Um it is
42. 16:28so I just one thing I just want to correct something on on flock and I prefer not to get into specifics because I think we need to focus on uh generic license plate readers and uh how to approach them because two months from now it could be another company but the research that I did showed that any access to these systems required an active permission on by the uh entity that owns that contract including PL but they to be hacked. So if they could be hacked, anything could happen. But I just wanted I just want to say that but I think we would be better served focusing on the technology in general because two months from now, six months from now could be some other entity and what we need are policies and procedures that ensure and the police department hats and police department has developed very robust policies and procedures. We want to ensure that both the privacy uh and and safety of other individuals and at the same time allow the police department to do their job.
43. 17:26Absolutely. So that's where we that's the balance we have to find. as far as uh miss reads uh drugs are concerned and that's with we've seen that again with our LPR we've had for 20 years uh misreads of a state uh uh a plate and that's part of our policy is that the officer has to confirm first that it's correct before any further action is taken. um by that officer in the vehicle. Um whether that's visually seeing it um and if it's wrong then they can enter it as as a wrong hit and no no further action is taken on their part and um that is right in our policy that has been posted online.
44. 18:23I think that you guys had it for 20 years. it allows you to tweak and and you know be transparent and be um I think it's a benefit right so because as things change you put the policy in place and everything so I think you guys should be commended that you're it's an ongoing thing right so as technology changes you know it's not something that just happened last week and you guys been dealing with it for 20 years tweaking it working out things working with the companies you know to eliminate some of the distress that some of the problem
45. 18:53so we have a couple of questions. I'm going to come back to you Jenny and I saw you had your numbers. I think with Chad
46. 19:01I mean if there's a mystery it's supposed to go to court if there if there's a license plate mystery they see someone red light for it to bring them to court and then to determine whether or not it's correct.
47. 19:14Well if there was a misread the officer wouldn't take any action if if they go through a red light. That's what I've seen. You know so there's there's a complete difference. They have a whole set of uh it's a read for a stolen I'm going to use a stolen vehicle for instance. If it comes up pay stolen vehicle okay well is it the correct state and are those the correct numbers that are showing that it actually read that one's definitely off. Okay.
48. 19:43Well, the officer does visual confirmation before any action. Yes.
49. 19:47Yeah. Recently, sorry. Can can I come back as Jason had his hands and then I'll come back to you and Jimmy? Jason.
50. 19:56Hey. Um, I have some questions to understand better. Um, thank you for the portal. I looked at it. Um, so the hot can you help explain the hot list? There's um I said 30 days. It's a it's a lot of hits on the hot list. Who creates the hot list? I just heard something that sound like maybe you're getting hot things from outside from state police or something and seeing it here. Could you explain that? And then some of there's one on here for one terrorist. Where does that come from? There's some examples of what the hot list is and what the categories are and how you action on them. The plate and standing there's over 2,000 hits people getting tickets.
51. 20:45So So the plate standing is movable vehicles in the city. So look at the if the LPR reads it. Yeah.
52. 20:56What's the action? So if the LPR reads it and the officer is in their car driving down the road and it gives them an alert, it's almost instant. Um they can stop, they can go turn around, they can confirm that that's it, they can move to be they do have to get verification from parking that it is right but created from it outside the county as well.
53. 21:22So Axon has like a set of things that you can select to alert you on and outside of our bootable vehicles that is New York State. So if there's a plate a particle plate associated with a terrorist for example that would automatically be sent to that will automatically be in the system from New York State, right? And it just means that if there was a hit that means it was a partial it could have been a partial plate or match but we would have to verify that that is even there's any further action needed.
54. 22:03It's kind of a flip of saying you're sharing you're not sharing your data with everyone or outside the state but the hot list is coming to you from your state only New York state. Um if I understand that or not, I would tell uh it's a lot of hits and but it could be multiple hits, right? A vehicle could be on the bootable list, but it lasts for a week.
55. 22:29So it may not be removed from that and so you know 10 of those 2,000 could be one vehicle that happens to be on the list for that week. Okay? So that's why we have to do that extra verification.
56. 22:40We update the the bootable vehicle list once a week. Um once parking gives it to us then it gets input into the LPR system and that happens once a week because it does take some time to to configure the list and get it into the format that it needs immediately.
57. 22:49How like how many of your officers are allowed to search the list the health guard like you said you shared with the council an example of a few days and it is it's happening a lot five times seven times I counted five different officers um level officers yes
58. 23:22all officers they all get trained can Can I come back to some other questions?
59. 23:30Okay. So, Jenny, I think you had your handbook.
60. 23:33Um, according also to the research that I did, um, the you are able to opt out of the cloud option. You're able to get what are they calling it? A not Oh, it just says noncloud option. you you so you could opt out of this and it would just be internal. I think the most lost for my my fear you going to add I'm sorry are you finished your question? Yeah.
61. 24:07Okay, go ahead. is is that while now, okay, that data is secure, it's a year from now, it may not be. A year from now, there may be subpoenas. It could be all sorts of things. And we're seeing it before our eyes today, you know, where things that we thought were sort of sacred and and secure are not necessarily so. So Gary, what what on a pre-rime AI now? A pre-rime to determine who might commit a crime. So that's terrifying.
62. 24:42Yeah, my understanding from and this may or may not be correct, but my understanding from what the research that I had done was that it's currently you have a 30-day expiration contract and potentially that could move to a 7-day contract. Uh again, retention. Yes, once the once the retention period is over, the data is wiped from the system entirely. So that is my understanding that may or may not be correct but that is what has been public and it is white.
63. 25:17But you know is that really true is anything ever is ever anything is anything ever totally I mean see Jenny I may not be able to like uh believe any of your concerns about this potential new technology but if it was new technology added to this I'm sure it would come at a cost. I can't say that for certain and we probably would and we would have to ask for approval to be able to do that.
64. 25:45So I I'm going to get to the public in a moment. I want to finish any question that the council has.
65. 25:50Oh, mine is more of a statement because related to this issue and circling back to this is a scary thing. I think we're all something I've already said this the last meeting. Some I think we're all a little freaked out in the world nationally, politically, regardless of where you sit.
66. 26:06Things are weird. Technology moves fast. The law does not move so fast. The language that protects us does not move as quick as quickly as everything else in like the tech sector, which we all purchase and use. And it's it's it's freaking us all out.
67. 26:27We're lucky to be here. We have a great city. We're protected well. And we want to give them the best tools to protect us. at the same time keeping ourselves feeling as safe. Echoing things Jenny say, our personal freedoms, we don't want those infringed upon and we have a nice little place to keep ourselves safe.
68. 26:46Um, just I think we're all smart enough to understand that we have a great place and we should be small changes at best so we don't rock the boat too much. And I just would point out that our current system helps solve the last murder in Hudson.
69. 27:07And our current system uh helped find that. Was it the clock system? Was it the Axon? Helped help find 2-year-old this year and it helped prevent a tragedy for the teenager who was headed to the Rip Van Winkle Bridge this summer. It does and it probably helps us in a lot more ways than we don't see. doesn't make it to the public gossip circle or the news.
70. 27:37And that's all I just think we have a a nice thing. We just want to massage this out. Keep keep a system that works for us where it works for us.
71. 27:47Ronnie or we haven't heard anything from you comments? No. Okay. Jason, you had a comment.
72. 27:47Um just to follow up on the last two. Um, I echo some of what Henry said, but um, this dealing with the fact that we have rights to videotape and there was another incident recently where we learned about rights of videotaping and expectations of privacy in the public. I think that complicates this issue.
73. 28:10But when I did go through the um procedures or the policy HBD, the one thing that stood out was that uh under 4B 2B um that it is about finding a an individual is planning criminal conduct and I wonder how you interpret that and whether you think that's appropriate to have.
74. 28:33um it says is involved in or is planning criminal conduct and that feels like a slippery slope or something that I don't think about as a non public uh
75. 28:47you would interpret that as if say for example we're here with the council that if you said that there was a person outside waiting who might have a gun and we had the ability to to look at that person we would use that tool to try to determine that before any interaction were to happen.
76. 29:10But we would also not just use the tool. We would send an officer to interview that. So it wouldn't be as something that we are like actively looking at to find something. It's if we were to receive a complaint, we've had to do that at the Seven Street Park where we've done complaints of folks fighting or threatening someone. Um and we will that's like a probable cause, right?
77. 29:37and and every use has to be logged into an incident. Um, so every time that we want to run a search for a plate, that has to be attached to one of our New York City incidents that is going on a report that is giving right at that point. It's some sort of investigation, whatever that investigation may be.
78. 29:53So, it's long. It's not like and then we're auditing that. We're seeing, okay, there's a case number. Great. There's no case number. Why? Um, so that's kind of an internal checks and balances on us where it's got to be one of our case numbers and it has to have an official case um attached to it for for a search.
79. 30:24And you can't do a search without putting a case number in for a very very specific reason.
80. 30:33Yeah. And in response with our with our meeting um with my meeting with the mayor's office and President Morris, uh our policy does say periodic audits. We agreed that it would be done every 30 days the first of the month with the safety meeting um before this morning.
81. 30:50And this is going to be an ongoing conversation as we try to flesh out a balanced approach here which both meets law enforcement need and also defense safety. Uh do we have any council members online?
82. 31:04No. So we have a couple of people in the room who raised their hands. Are there any other comments from to council before I go to the public? Okay. Uh sir, I think you had your hand up first.
83. 31:16Hi Chris Bishop. Um, I noticed the ax on camera when it was being installed in front of my house on Green Street this summer. So, you know, I I understand you've had plate readers and cars and vehicles for 20 years, but these are new. Axon rolled it out just last year.
84. 31:37They're being installed this year. They're on the light post on Green at Harry Howard for the uh elementary school, the former middle school and on Third Street coming. Um they capture more than just plates. They capture the color of the car, any defects in the car, bumper stickers and capture faces of the uh drivers if they're coming towards the camera. Um distinctive clothing, stuff like that. They'll take as many as 20 or 30 photos of a single vehicle, capture all these details. So, it's more than just plates.
85. 32:21And then this data, you know, it's like we're we're taking all this information in. Is that something we want to do for surveillance to have such a such a broad range of surveillance remain? One thing, um, another thing I'll say is, um, there is one block camera in town on Warren Street that you probably know that's owned by a private individual. And I don't see how it is acceptable for a private individual to buy buy a subscription, one of these things, install it, and then start being able to surveil their neighborhoods in their community without any oversight.
86. 33:00May I speak to that directly? just I did happen to have a conversation with that resident and they are and I was mistaken on my timeline at the meeting. Um he we asked him to take it down or switch it over to the Axon system and he was more than willing to do it. Um I thought it would be within a week but he said as soon as this um subscription expires he'll switch over um to the Axon system that will only be recorded for that HPD and they will you will not have access to.
87. 33:32That is correct.
88. 33:33Axon does not have any private contract and I too if a private residence does have a contract with the flock system, they can only I can't remember fully, but you do not have the ability to look at all of the data. You can see hits, but you cannot I can't remember um you do not have the same access to that data as let's say law enforcement, right? But they own the data. They can share it. I very broadly if they want to I don't know if their contract actually allows them to do that and within our conversation he was very clear that I know that he shared it with the sheriff. Yes.
89. 34:10And I think he could share it beyond the share.
90. 34:12I don't think so. I think he's only allowed to share it with law enforcement pending that but Oh, law enforcement but it could be national.
91. 34:18That is absolutely correct. Yes. Yes. Um but he is going to take it down. Yeah, I would the one thing and we will circle back and I'll mention it at the next meeting about private cameras and private private absolutely I think if we start talking about private or cameras many times I'm sorry about ring doorbells and security cameras um it's a it's a slippery slope there's a there's a lot it's a more complicated conversation these are much more automated yes well private residences private cameras private property is their constitutional right.
92. 34:53But of course, almost all cameras are going to be an AI program in the near future and we have to just collaborate and I wrote video things now and uh happily volunteer to work with HPD, but you're you're setting up a system that will be in place for decades or whatever indefinitely into the future that might have nefarious consequences down the on it as this information as we know from hacking and stuff does get out does break out and you know Axon might change their policy or something might happen or the federal government might demand a secret back door into this data without being you know it being revealed to the public. So there's all these abuses possible. Yes.
93. 35:46And it's something you should consider before. Yes. Sorry. You had your home.
94. 35:52Thank you. My name is Herman William Nichols the third student. I just wanted to piggy back on what Chris said a little bit. Now I do concede there's a lot of good benefits to these systems. Uh we can see through uh detailed list of what already happened the actions that took place. Um but I do want to kind of look forward into the future and the potential of what could happen going through the Supreme Court.
95. 36:10Now what they're looking at one's called the mosaic theory. Um, when you do have one tile of information, you can see license plate reader, but then as you start setting up all these other cameras, information becomes a whole picture of information and there's a upscaling effect where they're not so to speak violating the fourth amendment rights at this point, but it gets scary as the technology upscales um into the future. Um, and just one analogy, the master key effect.
96. 36:44Um, we may trust our chief and our sheriff at this point in time. I heard a lot of good things and we see in the community the changes in a positive direction, but there's future administrations that's going to inherit this technology as well. And we don't know how the future goes. We don't know how different administrations are going to take it or maybe might not may not be as kind. Um, just because we did something for 20 years, I don't know how that argument is, but sometimes the future looks back and we might not be making the right decision. this time for 20 years. It might not be the right thing.
97. 37:17And I really don't have too much else to say, but uh Robert Hein quote I said from the last meeting, there's no such thing as a free lunch. So something you might think we got grants and uh we got the flock cameras coming in for free so to speak or there was it was within the budget.
98. 37:34We had to spend for it meetings, but there's no such pretty much. So we have some people online.
99. 37:42You got bills. Can you hear me?
100. 37:51Can you hear me? Yes.
101. 37:53Yes. [clears throat] Hey. Um, I'd like to uh give my two cents about this if I could. And also I have two questions afterwards. Um, it seems like technology [clears throat] like this uh plate uh reading cameras is a [clears throat] like it's like a distraction from and a further erosion of local community policing because these cameras are picking up information from people who are passing through town.
102. 38:19Let's face it, we got thousands and thousands and thousands of vehicles passing through town and the cameras are on those streets, those main streets, the pass through streets. These cameras are not policing uh the problems that Hudson, downtown Hudson has. I'll give you a few examples if I could of what these cameras are not doing.
103. 38:41They're not checking speed of vehicles. The increase in speed of vehicles on State Street, State Street has gotten completely out of hand. And these cameras are doing nothing to stop it. But we're t we've been talking for 20 minutes about about these cameras and we never talk this much about speeding vehicles in town.
104. 38:59Or how about all the the latest bigger big problem on our streets and sidewalks of scooters, electric scooters and electric bikes. The number of kids and adults zipping down the State Street sidewalks repeatedly has gotten gotten so bad. But these cameras aren't doing anything about it.
105. 39:23And I think the the big picture problem is that the police department is now focusing on these super important cameras and all the information that they're feeding them, but they're not taking care of us downtown here. I mean, these cameras aren't really like reading the license plates of of of city residents. It's mostly pass through vehicles and and finding thousands of unregistered vehicles. How is this helping the the the average citizen in Hudson and our quality of life?
106. 39:57Okay, Bill, I'd like I'd like to respond to that.
107. 40:01Um, the reason we are discussing this is that this had come up as a topic from the community and therefore we are discussing it this evening. Uh, that's why we are discussing cameras. There are many other issues that we could discuss but that is why we are discussing this this evening. Do you have another hand raised?
108. 40:19Yes, I got Ronald. Yes. Go ahead, Ronald. Go ahead, Ronald.
109. 40:26It's actually Matt McG Pat McGee who Yes. Hello. Uh I'm more concerned about the fact that I'm sorry. I'm more concerned about the fact that the records of what the cameras record are stored [clears throat] out of control of the police department, for example, and they're in other people's hands.
110. 40:59And just because you have to have a password to go look at them from the police station, that doesn't mean that they cannot be looked at where they are being stored by the people who have charged them. And I think it's a dangerous thing. I I believe that the federal government's actions in recent last year and so have shown that [clears throat] the way they use the information to go after people with ICE and I think it's dangerous for us all and I think it should not be allowed. Thank you.
111. 41:45Thank you. Uh any other any other hands? No.
112. 41:51Okay. Uh in the room Lloyd, you've been waiting your voice shimmer. It was a very interesting discussion. So on a personal note, I kind of wish that the counters had caught that naked guy in the parking lot and he had some such things.
113. 42:12So I would like her you know to be protected from [clears throat] so but on a much broader that's a personal note on much broader scale I mean it's kind of interesting I mean the surveillance has been around if you want to really go back just look at marketing market research through history people have been doing market research through the ages you know madam matt what he used to call it in the 50s and the 60s Madison Avenue so that you know you know because of the survey they can tell when a woman's pregnant because she buys suns shampoo.
114. 42:50So there's a lot of ways in which this information can be you know you know but what I consider kind of interesting is you can make all the policy you want but when push comes to shove and someone wants to do whatever the hell they want to do just look at co we have all these protections we weren't supposed to do things we put out an experimental drug that made half the world take care people don't want to talk about co I'm sorry but that uh have happened just too stupid and we don't want to deal with the repercussions of one one of the biggest things that happened in the last 10 years you know and kind of what it did to society how alienated people another co I mean you talk to I I tried to bring this up two years ago at the library and why did I give this response oh my god you know my book [clears throat] whatever and then they don't want to talk about it but you know there were repercussions Lori what's the point in relation The point is in relation to the point is you know there are certain things that people get away and change policy. Mhm.
115. 44:05You can put a policy in place like the FDA policies the NIH had policies and they threw them out the window. Okay. Vaccines, you know, had to go through a freaking period of testings. They threw them out the window. Right. So, I'm just saying you can put all the policies in place you want, but when someone wants to break the rules. Okay. Well, go ahead and do it.
116. 44:29Okay. Thank you, Lord. Um, so Gary, you have Gary, you have your hand.
117. 44:34I did. Thank you. Um, so I trust the guidelines that we have here in the police department. Um, and and I look forward to, you know, to seeing Senator Heni's resolution being passed. But meanwhile, what if the another person comes into town, sets up a flat camera, and has the information go off into the cloud into, you know, wherever they're selling this information? Um, should we have some regulations in place?
118. 45:06Well, here's the problem with that. Um, and Jenny had brought up the new Lebanon resolution. We could put something in place saying that uh public entities, police department for example, or the county cannot install a camera on on city property, which is what New Lebanon did. They said there can be on our property there can be no none of these block cameras. Trying to control what a private citizen can put on in their own property for their security system would be, I think, very very difficult.
119. 45:33And if you go around town and you look at the like at least a thousand Nest and Google cameras on every pretty much every door in Hudson, would that regulation also say that you cannot have a security camera on your phone because those things are collecting information and there's very little protection in terms of safeguarding uh the privacy of what is being stored on on all of those Google apps. So I think I get your point. I understand it. But I think that that would be a very very difficult thing to do.
120. 46:13So we have another council member. Does that answer your question?
121. 46:13Yeah, it's good response.
122. 46:19I think if we can regulate chickens and they're in someone's private property, we can regulate.
123. 46:26Okay. Go ahead.
124. 46:28I mean, I think the question is, you know, is there is there a right to privacy and it's public? Not really. Um that's right. most first amendment people heard that right I mean I think that's the overall issue is there a right to privacy if something happens to the public uh do you have your own personal right to privacy um I know that as soon as the law is broken into the first question is there a camera that is that has seen that um and like I said that goes beyond us here as a local municipality but
125. 47:02do we have any I'm getting there do we have I like to ask council members first because we had some council members in their hands. Any other council members? We are I am going to have to wrap this up in a moment. Uh yes, go ahead.
126. 47:15I just want to say that can you identify yourself please?
127. 47:18My name is Emish. I'm a student at uh child high school former resident Hudson. Uh I want to say that the ICE does have access through their department uh homeland security contract with Axon to the system. There's an immigration violators list uh hot list that can be opted into by the sheriff and even if our current sheriff right now or not sheriff sorry uh chief of police right now might not opt into that that could be opted into in the future. Um so that's dangerous and that collaboration could happen.
128. 47:51And furthermore I don't think it's an issue of privacy and our rights in public. I think it's an issue of the public level of opinion and the public will against this. You know, just because you aren't commanded by law to protect us from this or to preserve our privacy doesn't mean that your role as elected officials isn't to enforce the public will. Uh and the public will is strong when it prevents this.
129. 48:28Thank you. And uh I I just want to I do want to make one comment uh about non cooperation. New York State has passed a law uh [clears throat] not allowing local uh and county police departments to cooperate in any way. Hang on. With f federal agencies. That said, 14 counties are still uh still have agreements and 16 are suing the state. So that is something to pay attention to. But your point is well made that uh it depends on what the various entities choose to do and if they choose to cooperate then we have a problem.
130. 49:07That's correct.
131. 49:08And uh well formal cooperation in the 27G agreements were out uh collusion on an individual officer level uh is very much not I think that's a fair question. I mean, I don't know exactly how many police officers are in our department, but there's a, you know, there's a certain amount of public support for ICE and if there are one or two police uh officers that are willing to give that data to them, then it's going to happen and and I and I think that chief, I think I think if that happened and they were violating your policies, you would take action.
132. 49:39our policy and our previous mayor's standing executive order.
133. 49:51Yeah. So, I think we need to move on. Thank you all very very much for your comments. Um, we will, the chief and I will continue to try to flesh out something with the mayor's office and we will be reporting back to you and you keep it on your agenda in the safety committee and got it.
134. 50:09Let's move on. Sorry. That was No, I don't. Sorry. Code enforcement was great. Done.
135. 50:16[laughter]
136. 50:18Okay. And we'll talk about code enforcement in a moment. All right. Next on our agenda is the bills. Uh if you have the recognizing Okay. So, um do we have any questions on the do we have any questions?
137. 50:43Yeah. Um, one of the ones I I need to go back and do some research, but it does. Which one? The one for 10,000, not one for 5,000.
138. 50:53Uh, that is for the climate smart uh project. No, that's a memory. Excuse me. I'm having a memory of us talking about proono and asking us asking questions about why they would do a pro bono and then giving a long explanation. So, I need to go back.
139. 51:11Okay.
140. 51:12because they that bill initially got emailed to me. Okay. And I wrote back and I said, "This is nothing I ever talked about or approved." Um, and it took them about a week or two and they wrote back and said, "Oh, that went to the wrong person." And then I find out this week that evidently was in the mayor's office and I'm just questioning that.
141. 51:32So, we could potentially pull one from this list if there's a question about it. I think that would be the wise. Yeah. over approving also and I have started well no I we can amend this list that's fine I what I do is I make notes of whatever you want it and that was that one was signed up on by the mayor's office
142. 51:54I can I just like a moment to remind myself um I do remember that because I had asked the question it was pro bono the uh they're putting a grant together and the hopes were that they would get to work. There were two grants. So the Yeah, I'm not sure which.
143. 52:14One one was climate smart. That's the 10,000 and the other is LWR before that the one that was dealing with the triangle hospital. That was another one that that was for sure proponent. I bought the second one as well. So I just like Okay. So I think I think the sensible thing to do here is um to pull both so that we can get clarification. I think the other one is much more clear. So the mayor actually entered that one the LWRP one. Yes.
144. 52:44Okay. So we leave that be approved. Uh and we will pull the one for 10k. Uh any questions on any other Thank you for that. Any other questions on the bills?
145. 52:56Okay. So with the revision that we are pulling the $10,000 for further uh information and we can bring that back if if everything's okay. We can bring it back next week. But for all of the other bills, can we get a um a roll call about Sorry, we need an introduction.
146. 53:16Well, the motion to pay the bills, Rich and the second Denny. And now we need a roll call.
147. 53:24President Morris. Yes.
148. 53:28Council member, he just went to the rest of Okay. Thank you. Sorry. I'm sorry. What was it? I think you Oh, good to be back. Hagen. Yes. Yes. Sarah, yes. I pass.
149. 54:11Um before we get to the resolutions, uh I want to introduce and lay on your desk um three local laws. Um the first uh is a local law relating to and these were all reviewed by legals local law related to uh city innovation buildings. Um you can review that and review it against the current uh code. uh our building Portland officer is working very diligently to identify and uh take action on abandoned and vacant buildings and in doing so has identified some issues in how to code.
150. 54:58Uh the primary issue on this one was the order in which the priorities were lifted at demolition as the first option rather than the land of exort. Uh the second one which is related to that is uh lower law amending chapter 97 of the code which relates to demolition of buildings. Um this the the areas of greatest concern for a vote important officer uh one related to uh demolition of a building um where damage is made done to an adjacent property.
151. 55:29As written, the code would hold the individual responsible for the damission liable if they did damage to a property with a party wall. However, if they did damage to an adjacent property that did not have a party wall, they had no liability, which obviously makes some sense. So, that was changed. And then the other piece that we added was which was not in our code uh a requirement that um if if a property is demolished that the site has to be left clean.
152. 55:59It has to be leveled because as some of you have noticed we have some situations where we basically are left with a hole in the ground. So those are those are these are uh given the work that he's doing on this these are uh really critical to have us pass. Jenny brought up an issue in the legal committee uh with regard to the penalty for demolishing a building without a permit which is currently it was set at 250 uh in this um 350 in this version it has been increased to 5,000 which and Jason you also talked about that um which is fairly low and I think something that we need to review and go back to
153. 56:41Um I think we can take it up maybe next month once we've done more research. Um there may be uh requirements if we want to set it to market value for example that we have to go through the steps of the state to do that. But what I would what I would like you to do is to review these local laws. We will be voting on them next week. Um they are I'm going to get to you. They are a priority for our code enforcement officer uh to help him do his work and we will revisit the penalty issue uh next week. Was your comment about these two? Okay. Go ahead. Um
154. 57:24first of all thank you uh if you call for yes in the past several years ago and we have not collected any fees any vacancy um and the idea was that property it's $1,000 in the first year and up to $5,000 however uh section six number two I don't know if this if it's launch if it is stage four it's was it says the subsequent after section
155. 57:57Two subsequent annual fees shall be paid as follows and wait where are you I'm on section six of the law of the law uh not chapter 91 chapter chapter six the second.
156. 58:14I'm sorry listen for the big building along the Sorry.
157. 58:23So you're only seeing the amendments here. Okay. Just check.
158. 58:27Yes. I'll just be doing between now and next week go back and look at the full. Yes.
159. 58:35Um any other question that since I did bring up that issue, it's way better to have the 5,000 250 and thank you Jenny for doing that research. But I feel good about where you're at. Good. Thank you. Uh the next one.
160. 58:52Sorry.
161. 58:52So does this allow us because it's a new law to go backwards to that anything that's existing now. Can we correct that?
162. 59:00I no I think this is just we will we will enact these local laws and then they will be in effect within uh once it is filed with shortly come effective immediately upon filing with the secretary of state.
163. 59:12No, what I'm saying is there's a property right now that's in violation.
164. 59:14Yes. Is it a grandf I do not? You would have to take that up with Nick. I don't know what current status of properties is. I do know that.
165. 59:22I thought that's Ken thing, but I said specifically we need what situation you thinking of.
166. 59:29Well, it's there's a property right now that has a hole in it. That's that's that's been demolished. Has a hole in it. We passed this law. Will it because it's because they had it before this law. Is is there a case from this? No, you put this law in effect. It was already done. Is there Is it affected that property that they got?
167. 59:53I think it's probably in the past. It's in the past. I'll check your language, but I think I think that's all part of the permit is Yeah. But I don't move forward. Yeah. So I think probably the past it is in the Okay. So the third law that I'm introducing and laying on your desks is uh the last part of the B schedule updates uh because it relates to updating the code. We have to have a local law for essentially fix violations that are currently in code and reflects the fees and that would be certainly agreed to. Okay. And we will take those up next.
168. 1:00:33Okay. Uh, next we have resolutions. You ready for resolutions?
169. 1:00:41Um, all right.
170. 1:00:46So, we have a commissioner of deeds resolution. Get my notes here. All of them. Uh, appointing three new commissioners. Um we have a resolution uh authorizing the mayor to issue a request for proposal for the dock management uh and maintenance. You recall last year this issue came up um at the point that we were doing the contract and so this is the RFP court uh document for management and Jenny has question.
171. 1:01:17I just wanted to mention that we did get a um communication about this. I saw that and I I did read but um the resolution that was in um Kingston and it was just much simpler.
172. 1:01:38We're not Kingston though. Yeah. Yeah. We have a fraction.
173. 1:01:42Yeah. And I I reflecting upon what we have. We don't have a river. I'm sorry. We we don't have autary security river that we have thousands of feet dock space on. They have a mile of dock. It's they have such a I don't think it really equates to this. I do like it, but I think if we but this is this is not a contract. This is a resolution.
174. 1:02:04I understand that. I just like the way it was.
175. 1:02:09It would be nice if we could have something like that with change. So if you if you want to you know we will not take any action on this until next week. If you want to look at this and correspond with the mayor because this is uh coming from the mayor's office and uh ask the mayor if you go back to resolve that.
176. 1:02:26Okay.
177. 1:02:28Next resolution uh is from DPW transfers. These are all transfers within departments for DPW cemetery water and sewing through on that one. Um next is a resolution authorizing sale of um service equipment. Um again that does not seem particularly need of discussion.
178. 1:02:55Um so the next two um which if possible I would actually like to vote on these this evening. um uh it was brought up um just before the meeting. The next two resolutions relate to a uh grant application, the public hearing that we just had uh a grant application for uh 50,000 $52,000 actually uh to assess the water uh system and so forth. And as part of that application, there was a requirement that we have the public hearing before uh voting on the meeting. Uh but there also is the requirement that we have a fair housing officer.
179. 1:03:35Uh until December of last year, we had a fair housing officer listed. Uh Theresa Joiner was our fair housing officer. She was not reappointed and first resolution simply appoints Michelle Tulos as our fair housing officer. Um the second resolution uh there is a requirement that we have a policy first of all that we have an equal opportunity uh equal employment opportunity officer and also that we have a policy.
180. 1:04:00So we do currently have a policy on equal employment. Um this particular one was sent uh by the group that is uh you know handling the application for the grant. Um the the superintendent of public works would be the uh equal employment uh opportunity officer. Um this policy when compared to what is currently on the books for us.
181. 1:04:32Our current policy has mostly focused on how to file complaints. Complaints are filed through the clerk. There's no language in there about timelines. Uh this one on my read uh is more expansive. It addresses um uh uh ac appropriate accommodations. Um it actually requires that there be a uh an officer. The process for complaints includes timelines that you have to respond within the next number of days. Uh if the complaint is within the officer's department, then it has to either go to the mayor and if it's in the mayor's office, it has to go to the council president.
182. 1:05:13So to me, this of other policies I've looked at, uh, this one seems to me to be much more robust than what we currently have on the books. So I did not have any. I know you haven't had much opportunity to read it. Um, I don't know if we can vote on these this evening. Um, since we have a policy, do we have to can we just replace with this or is there something else we need to do?
183. 1:05:35And by the way, the reason um uh it came up as to whether or not we could vote on it tonight was the application deadline is Wednesday of this week. These can be sent in after the fact if necessary, but it might be preferable to send them in, but you you can you are allowed to bring up a resolution of any meeting. So you it's not a law.
184. 1:06:04Okay, this one is fine. Do is there anything else we have to do since we have a employment opportunity policy where the other step we have to do to replace that policy with this policy?
185. 1:06:17I know it looks like by it just seems like it would by default supplant the other one adopting new policy.
186. 1:06:26Yeah. Yeah. Adopting this policy and my read of it is a much better policy than the one that we currently have on the books. the one we have on the book really just talks about complaints and if you have a complaint you file it with the clerk's office and then there's no timeline there's no you know you must respond within the next number of days there's nothing about uh reasonable accommodations for people with disabilities and so forth yes um something I heard that I'd like is that defining the officer as a superintendent of public work yes we have to we have to have a named equal uh employment
187. 1:06:59How did you come up with that? I did not come up.
188. 1:07:06So that's person is probably the largest apartment in the city. Kind of seems like a conflict, but I don't know. It's not about the person.
189. 1:07:16It seems like that doesn't seem like the right person to to monitor people.
190. 1:07:22Okay. So what we What was your question again? I think I might have an answer. You're saying that there's the officer at like HPD being the organiz.
191. 1:07:34Yeah. Is that person would be the officer of equal employment? Okay. A good point.
192. 1:07:40The largest employer in the city like between the Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Is this a union thing?
193. 1:07:48No.
194. 1:07:50It's not a a union man like union puts that superintendent as that person. No, there it has nothing to do with Okay, this uh my understanding is as they were putting together this application, they had to have a a clear policy on equal employment uh equal opportunity employment and they also have to have a named officer and Rob was put in. So if we want to we can discuss it.
195. 1:08:17Well, we can hold this one. Um to point I think there's a car on it that says that if the person is for that department, they would go automatically.
196. 1:08:32Oh, okay.
197. 1:08:33So it says that what you [clears throat] I haven't seen it, but I'm going off a little.
198. 1:08:38So here's here's what here's what it says. Um yes, it does. Hang on a second. Uh complaint procedure. Um where the complaint concerns the equal employment opportunity officer, it may be filed with the mayor or with the pres council president where it concerns the mayor. So there's a provision in here to allow for a complaint if it's within the department of the exact what it said. It said if the complaint is with the person, not within the department.
199. 1:09:12if it concerns the equal employment opportunity officer. Right. Anything within his department concern.
200. 1:09:21I'm sorry. What? I'm not reading it that way.
201. 1:09:24If the complaint concerns the offices, it be filed in the It doesn't mean everyone within the department.
202. 1:09:35Yeah. Said everyone in the department would have to go into Maryland because because Bob would be limited. It would be automatically.
203. 1:09:41So here's here's what I would argue to the gent.
204. 1:09:45Okay, we have we have two resolution two separate things. First resolution appoints superintendent as the officer. The other resolution um adopts a uh policy relating to. So what they I think would be good is if we could pass the policy, hold on the resolution of the appointment clarification and then also uh appoint the h the housing uh fair housing officer. So that for the application we have a new fair housing officer. We will have an updated policy which is more robust than the one we have right now. And then we will hold off on the one related to who should be the officer for internal appointment.
205. 1:10:32Are there three resolutions there?
206. 1:10:33There actually three. They're put together.
207. 1:10:37The appointment of the person is separate.
208. 1:10:39It is separate. That is correct. The resolution is together. Well, this the name on this one is adopting the policy and finding the gas service. But then there's a second resolution adopted by resolution. This is employed opportunity policy adopted bar but they're interconnected. Do we need to hold this off?
209. 1:10:59No. But what you need to do basically you have a resolution to do two things and this is just what you're doing there. The resolution should be restated to be a resolution to adopt the city as employment policy and completely strike it from amend the resolution to delete all [clears throat] the things that having to do with the appointment.
210. 1:11:17Okay. So first of all we need a motion to uh I mean there are there there wherefors and other things here. So you can amend the resolution but some of this relates to the policy you can leave um
211. 1:11:37no you can just delete delete the second line.
212. 1:11:41Yeah, I think you can amend just cross off. Yeah.
213. 1:11:49Okay. So, in this resolution um uh in the bullet number two now therefore be it resolved there is a statement the superintendent of public's work is designated as etc. So the amendment will remove that statement. Uh the title of the resolution will be a resolution um adopting an equal opportunity uh policy and we will strike and designating um the equal opportunity officer if we're not going to do that right now. Uh and then the policy itself is appended. So can we have a motion on that amendment?
214. 1:12:26Will we be able to mitigate all of those changes if we just change that sentence? Yes.
215. 1:12:33Which one? where the complaint concerns the equal employment officer like we can clarify that anybody reporting in that complaint procedure B change that sentence
216. 1:12:48I'm sorry you suggesting that we leave it as say you'd leave it as Rob
217. 1:12:56for complaint direct we just clarified to say that okay any complaints regarding ing or reporting for direct or indirect reports.
218. 1:13:07Direct and direct report of the officer, right? Right. That works.
219. 1:13:11That would work. The thing is if most of the personnel are in that department, maybe better off if everybody's in that department, if you're referring somewhere else, maybe you can just put legally that would work, but it's up to you, you know, the legisl Yeah.
220. 1:13:34The policy would then no longer need to be changed if we do still give into symptoms. You know what I mean? If the policy clarifies that anybody reporting to think of doing anything but everything would go to the mayor's office.
221. 1:13:48Well, you can do both. You could modify that language. So it says anybody in the department of the equal opportunity officer goes somewhere else to clarify that it's you know instead of the language about in relation to or whatever it's anybody in the department. And secondly, you could cross off the paragraph designating that person and reconsider that.
222. 1:14:01So then whoever, as you said, wherever it is, they might have to it would still be very clear that anyone within that department, right, would be I think that makes sense. I think that I like your idea. Um, we leave Rob as the officer and that's fine. would change this to say where the complaint concerns the equal employment of opportunity officer um or any of his direct or indirect reports.
223. 1:14:41Uh, it may be filed and I would change that to be it shall be filed with the mayor. Um, or with council president where it concerns the mayor or or any of his stuff because that should also be there or any of his parillegal.
224. 1:14:59Well, actually, I don't want to do that.
225. 1:15:01I don't want to say any of his stuff because if there is a complaint that goes to the mayor's office because all of the departments report. So let's not go there. Let's just say it goes to the mayor if it's any of the direct.
226. 1:15:15All right. So current motion to accept this amendment for Ronnie's suggestion.
227. 1:15:20Uh that is on um 8B read Jason Henry to amendment.
228. 1:15:33And so now if we can vote on the resolution adjusting people opportunity policy designating opportunity officer and we would need a roll call on that.
229. 1:15:46Sorry, hang on a second. We're looking for a piece of paper. Do you have any?
230. 1:15:52No, this one here. Did you get a Whoops.
231. 1:16:02Yes. Do I have a budget? No.
232. 1:16:10Okay. Roll call vote on second again.
233. 1:16:16Jason was motion for the amendment. Uh Henry will second for the amendment. I think we need a motion and inter amendment. Now need a motion to vote on the amended resolution which will be Jason and it will be Henry. I'm making you the second we're moving along here.
234. 1:16:37Okay. President Morris. Yes. Council member Had. Hi. Bernagen. Hi. Rooney. Hi. Sarah. Hi. Oster. Hi. Absent. Felton. Hi. Oo cousin.
235. 1:16:53Hi Moranti. Okay. I I do have a question. No, sorry. He didn't answer yet. I didn't answer. He didn't answer yet. Oh, sorry. Okay. Go ahead. Was Rob notified of this? Excuse me. Was Rob notified of this?
236. 1:17:09Rob gave me this. I assume he was the one.
237. 1:17:11That's [laughter] Rob gave me this and when I spoke to him before the meeting, he said, you know, I can send in the old policy with the application, but it would be better if he had the current. Great.
238. 1:17:25I think that's in pending place without separate.
239. 1:17:28Uh now we are no it's it's all one resolution the resolution is adopted the policy and the pharmacy the officer. So the next resolution we have which we don't need to amend um it says an fair housing officer. Can we have a motion?
240. 1:17:45Yes. Is there a financial impact on this?
241. 1:17:48I do not believe $1,000. Yeah. Is there $1,000? Oh, right. Okay. This is like It does like $1,000.
242. 1:17:57Second commissioner. But I I actually thought that she had been appointed as the warehousing officer back in January to be honest. Uh when Theresa was not reappointed.
243. 1:18:09Um but I mean we have to have we're required to appoint but I thought the appointment comes from the mayor anyway. So I don't know why I'm sorry.
244. 1:18:16I thought the appointment comes from the mayor anyway when it does. Yes. Yeah.
245. 1:18:20Um but this application requires that there be a council resolution. Right.
246. 1:18:27Right. Okay. So, we have a motion uh to vote on designating the fair housing officer. Yes. Go ahead.
247. 1:18:36Jason and Henry is a second, obviously.
248. 1:18:39Sure. I will I will. Yes, I'll second it.
249. 1:18:42Thank you so much. Now, can we have a vote?
250. 1:18:46President Loris. Yes. Council member. No. Hagen.
251. 1:18:55Hi.
252. 1:18:56Ro. Hi Sarah.
253. 1:18:59Hi Olster.
254. 1:19:01Hi Robert Samson Belton. Hi Ooen.
255. 1:19:08I Moranti. Okay.
256. 1:19:13So the things that we voted on um I think you need to sign it. So please that's all I have on resolutions. It is Sorry. You have you have
257. 1:19:27Yeah, you started with the hand Okay, Heather, go ahead. Apologies. I meant to take my hand down. I just wanted to with all the discussion about Rob Perry. I just wanted to point out that he was the one that self-elected himself for that role. So, yeah, that was not clear at time.
258. 1:19:47Okay, thank you. Um, okay. Do we have any old prisoners?
259. 1:19:53Another hand up there online. Yeah, Ronald. We have Ronald's hand up. Yeah.
260. 1:20:02Ronald, do you have a comment on this?
261. 1:20:04Uh, I had a question relating to the uh public hearing.
262. 1:20:11Why was the public hearing Why was the public hearing in person only? I'm sorry.
263. 1:20:17Why was the public hearing in person only? Is the game for strong?
264. 1:20:25Why was the public hearing?
265. 1:20:27I believe the public hearings are always in person only.
266. 1:20:31Well, I guess maybe I I'll make that a general question and ask why are they always in person only.
267. 1:20:36I I don't have an answer to that, I'm afraid.
268. 1:20:39Okay. because I I had a I had a technical issue when I tried to join this meeting and I wondered if it had anything anything to do with uh the public hearing because when I first tried to join this meeting the message I got on my computer was that the meeting was locked.
269. 1:20:55That is because uh we had the public hearing at 5:45 uh until 6 o'clock or until about 5 to 6 actually and we rescheduled the council meeting to start at 6:15 but there was only one link to it because we had an attorney client session from a little before 6 until 6:15 regarding litigation and then we started this meeting at 65.
270. 1:21:22So, there was an unannounced attorney client session.
271. 1:21:26No, there is no need to announce an attorney client. Okay. So, let I'll put it another way.
272. 1:21:31We did a session of which there was a session. We did No, I I I'd just like to finish what I'm saying. There I'll withdraw that characterization. There was a session of which the public had no knowledge and that's why the meeting was locked because I've only ever seen that message about meetings being locked in connection with executive sessions.
273. 1:21:53Okay. So I I thought that they were going to set up two separate sessions. That did not happen. So therefore we had our attorney client session uh using the link for the common council meeting. However, the common council meeting was posted on the website as beginning at 6:15. It was not posted as beginning at 6.
274. 1:22:15Well, I I I when I had this experience, it was after 6:15. But in any case, Matt would like to say something.
275. 1:22:22Yes. Um, I I would like to know if this is going can be looked into so that the public would be able to attend remotely when there's a public hearing. It would seem that you would want as many people to attend as as could be. And I know that other times when there are public hearings, for example, for landmarks, they are broadcast and you can do it remotely. And and I just it it seems to be turned on its head when you don't allow the public to interact as broadly as possible. And I think that should be fixed. Thank you.
276. 1:23:14Well, thank you for that and I will uh look into that and see if we can make future public hearings hybrid rather than just in person.
277. 1:23:22I think we could I don't see any I think we could broadcast it but I don't think we should take comments.
278. 1:23:29Let's let's think about it. But thank you for bringing that up and we will think about it and see what but at least find out what the rationale was for having it in person. I do know that when we have had certain sessions comments were only like this is very common with the planning board that they will not allow uh online commentary if you want to comment you have to come in person right so I think that may be an avenue but we will certainly look into that and get back to I don't see anything wrong with broadcast county board does that all the time actually uh okay uh any new Great.
279. 1:24:01Can we have a motion to adjurnn? Well, we I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Executive session. So, we want to session.
280. 1:24:27It's not an executive session. Uh, so we have a motion. I have a comment. usually a follow. I'm sorry. Can I make a follow comment at the end?
281. 1:24:35Yes, certainly.
282. 1:24:38I appreciate that. But I feel like I was kind of like, you know, when I was challenged about, you know, my point, it kind of threw me off and I was going to make a separate point earlier. I was wondering about the hot list and I have another thing I want to discuss after my real but I just follow [clears throat] up on I was wondering that hot that comes from the state how detailed is and is that spoiled and I [clears throat] kind of understand it's a rhetorical question almost and it's detailed information that's going to the police department and the public doesn't get it is that that a secret list so it's a very interesting point anyway that I'm going to put that to the side.
283. 1:25:21The question had I actually had another question.
284. 1:25:23Mash can answer that. Chief Frank can answer that.
285. 1:25:26Thank you. Thank you. I'm just throwing it out. Okay. I mean, we really don't care. The other take my picture. I don't care. I got nothing to hide. Anyway, but the real question your voice of reason and savior of the tree of peace and that's the reason I'm speaking at this moment because I'm curious about the tree of peace. It's been some two months since I've heard words. Well, actually, I think I heard a month ago from the stewardist of the tree, which is not on city property. It's not being car taken by the city.
286. 1:26:00Okay. Here's that Becky, the tree of peace was drooping and the stewardist attributed that to the excess rain. But I think it's because of size for the pot she's in. But I haven't really been able to inspect or I don't think anyone's been a chance had a chance to inspect in two months because it's locked behind a closed private person's gate. It's the last item. I was just wondering. So I I will give you a response. Is it there now? I will give you.
287. 1:26:30Okay. I can give you a response. This is the common council. Thank you.
288. 1:26:34Uh we have no authority over where that tree is. question as the mayor and a week ago at this farmers market he hoped he hoped he would have an answer for me at the next time he saw me because open meeting on Thursday is indicating to me that it's at the cemetery now who knows I don't know the the common council has absolutely zero jurisdiction over this I suggest that you bring it up to the mayor actually did say two or three months ago that would address it excuse me like about two or three months ago when I last maybe four months ago when I last brought it up and said it would come up in another meeting and we I believe at the at the subsequent meeting we indicated that it was it had been taken into custody by somebody that we don't have any I don't know whether it was the mayor had done it but we did actually comment on at the next meeting not concern that's fine um okay So other comments question.
289. 1:27:38Yeah, sorry. I'm sorry. I didn't know how to stand. Um Kia Welker. Yeah.
290. 1:27:45Um I just wanted to um say the last time I was here, I think it was in July um when you guys were doing the budget discussion of transferring money through a legal piece. And I know I'm from Mil Street and I know Mil Street isn't the only legal um discussion that you guys have. Um, but I just wanted to know if there was any more discussion about maybe a pathway of a settlement um that lawsuit and or was there a settlement agreement or another pathway to discuss that because I think that's just an easy fix and I know my neighbor Jack had sent in some information and I just wanted to know what's that going to be discussed? Um, is there another time that's going to be discussed and I didn't know if this was the appropriate time to ask that question. So, I'm just asking.
291. 1:28:32So, um, we have received your two resolutions. Um, we are getting advice from our attorneys on what the next appropriate action is. Um, I don't have an answer for you uh right now as to what the next action would be.
292. 1:28:53Um, but the questions that you've asked about the possibility of having a meeting with the uh other uh entity being sued was one that I did bring up, but I can't really discuss the litigation in public session. Um, but I encourage you to continue to correspond with us and to continue to come to meetings and to ask what the next steps are. But we are trying to get uh legal advice for the common council on what the next best steps are for us. But by all means come speak, send us communication. It's very helpful. Okay. Thank you.
293. 1:29:33Anything else?
294. 1:29:36Now you you're going to give me a motion to Yes. Do a motion to second. All in favor?
295. 1:29:45Any opposed? Well, no. Thank you.

Timestamps link to the corresponding moment on YouTube. Auto-transcribed, contains speech-recognition errors. Not an official record.